# STEROIDS FORUM > HORMONE REPLACEMENT THERAPY- Low T, Anti-Aging >  Test Results - TSH (THYROID STIMULATING HORMONE)

## Times Roman

Although my result was 1.26, the Kaiser standard range is between 0.10 and 5.50 which seems like a large range.

What are your thoughts on a 1.26?

What was your last result, and what did you do about it?

----------


## casberger

Seems pretty low to me. My last bloodwork showed a 1.17 and I am about to go on thyroid medication

----------


## pittbulldad

Kaiser sucks.. they will do anything to keep from paying so they have ridiculous levels that are limited to the worst case scenarios...

----------


## forrest_and_trees

Unfortunately, *most* doctors are a little behind the times and unaware the diagnosis process and range has changed. Recent studies have found that *everyone is different* and you cant go on TSH levels alone. More importantly, the symptoms need to be taken into account. 

If you exhibit the symptoms, it's still possible that even with "normal" TSH levels, you can have "Secondary or Tertiary Hypothyroidism". The only way to know for sure is to have your T3 and T4 checked. If you haven't already done so, that would be your next step.

In Oct of last year my TSH was 3.33. At the time my doc said *that* was normal and did nothing however, I was unsatisfied with the answer and continued my research. Based on my symptoms, I kept coming back to the same thing and eventually discovered that a newly recognized standard had been established.

I shared these findings with my doctor and after confirming them, he re-categorized me as having "Clinical Hypothyroidism" and agreed to put me on Synthroid on a trial basis. He started me on 75mcg daily and we went from there. As of my last test my TSH was 0.54; my doc said he wanted to get me closer to 0.1 and bumped me up to 200mcg daily.

----------


## RTR13

I've been having the same problem for the last 6 months. I've felt absolutely awful, and had my thyroid checked repeatedly. The lowest my TSH has been was 1.55, which was recently, but when I first started feeling awful it was 2.8. It then jumped to 4.3, then 2.6. It's all over the place.

Even though I have all the symptoms, no doctor has done anything about it. They all tell me that I'm fine. I don't know what to do about it anymore.

----------


## SlimmerMe

For : RTR13: 
Keep looking for a GOOD doctor--this is important--many of us here have searched all over for a doctor and this is now something you need to do
Welcome and GOOD LUCK! there is a lot of help here--this is a great start

----------


## forrest_and_trees

> I've been having the same problem for the last 6 months. I've felt absolutely awful, and had my thyroid checked repeatedly. The lowest my TSH has been was 1.55, which was recently, but when I first started feeling awful it was 2.8. It then jumped to 4.3, then 2.6. It's all over the place.
> 
> Even though I have all the symptoms, no doctor has done anything about it. They all tell me that I'm fine. I don't know what to do about it anymore.


I still say have your T3 and T4 check per my last post above. If none of your doctors will do it, use one of the online testing facilities and do it yourself. At least that way you'll know and if it turns out your levels are low, you can take the results back to your doctor. 

P.S. Have you had your Total Testosterone and E2 checked? If so, what were the numbers? If not, that's another possibility. When you say you've felt "awful" can you be a little more specific? What exactly are the symptoms?

----------


## RTR13

> I still say have your T3 and T4 check per my last post above. If none of your doctors will do it, use one of the online testing facilities and do it yourself. At least that way you'll know and if it turns out your levels are low, you can take the results back to your doctor. 
> 
> P.S. Have you had your Total Testosterone and E2 checked? If so, what were the numbers? If not, that's another possibility. When you say you've felt "awful" can you be a little more specific? What exactly are the symptoms?


Sorry about that. My symptoms have been broad. The main ones that are still bothering me are "brain fog", inability to concentrate properly, hard time finding the right words a lot of times, horrible fatigue (especially if I do anything physical for more than around 15 minutes), dry mouth for the better part of the day, muscle twitches all over my body, occasional shoulder/neck muscle aches, I get cold pretty easily (feet stay cold almost all the time, unless it's like 100 outside). I also get this "tingling" feeling a lot of times on random places on my body. It mostly happens on my head, especially the back of my head, and usually moreso when I get stressed out.

Another thing which is hard to explain, but my eyes at time just kind of refuse to focus. Like if I'm looking at the computer screen, my eyes kind of "cross", like they're too weak to focus. That's terribly annoying.

I had my testosterone checked, and free testosterone. The total T was 498 (range - 280-800), and free testosterone was 11.0 (range - 9.3-26.5).

Had free t4 and free t3 checked recently, and they were both within range. That was when my TSH was 1.55, the most recent test.

I'm at a loss. I dunno what to think anymore...

----------


## ReBilly

Well, your free T is low, your overall T is not optimal but not medical emergency low... I didn't feel very good and my numbers were similar, and that's why I started HRT in the first place. I had almost all the same feelings you did, and no sex drive at all. No problem with focusing on things or sever fatigue tho

----------


## forrest_and_trees

> Sorry about that. My symptoms have been broad. The main ones that are still bothering me are "brain fog", inability to concentrate properly, hard time finding the right words a lot of times, horrible fatigue (especially if I do anything physical for more than around 15 minutes), dry mouth for the better part of the day, muscle twitches all over my body, occasional shoulder/neck muscle aches, I get cold pretty easily (feet stay cold almost all the time, unless it's like 100 outside). I also get this "tingling" feeling a lot of times on random places on my body. It mostly happens on my head, especially the back of my head, and usually moreso when I get stressed out.
> 
> Another thing which is hard to explain, but my eyes at time just kind of refuse to focus. Like if I'm looking at the computer screen, my eyes kind of "cross", like they're too weak to focus. That's terribly annoying.
> 
> I had my testosterone checked, and free testosterone. The total T was 498 (range - 280-800), and free testosterone was 11.0 (range - 9.3-26.5).
> 
> Had free t4 and free t3 checked recently, and they were both within range. That was when my TSH was 1.55, the most recent test.
> 
> I'm at a loss. I dunno what to think anymore...


Interesting, most of what you described sounds just like what I've been going through too, with the exception of feeling cold; for me it's the opposite, I get hot flashes and night sweats. I've been on Synthroid for sometime now, 200mcg daily, and it's helped some but it wasn't until I got my E2 under control that I noticed the greatest improvement. It was *way* out of whack, 167, and after a month or so of Arimidex , it's now 47 and I feel *much* better. More energy, much clearer thinking, sleeping better and my eyes even feel better too.

What about your libido and overall sexual performance? How's that? Everything you mentioned sure sounds like thyroid, but is there anything else your feeling that you didn't mention? I'm just reaching for straws here because your numbers seem to indicate you're fine but clearly your symptoms don't. 
*
Question to the board:*
I'm just throwing this out there but, is it possible for someone to have normal T levels and still have elevated E2; which could cause his symptoms?

Then again, maybe you're just one of those lucky people who falls outside the norm and regardless of your "numbers" you still have the symptoms and need to get on some thyroid treatment? You can always try what I did which was to simply ask my Dr. if it couldn't hurt to just *try* some low dose thyroid treatment for a couple months just to see how I respond. That's what finally did it for me. If your current doctor wont help you, then I say move on until you find someone who will.

----------


## forrest_and_trees

bump.... 

Wasn't getting any response so I edited and elaborated a little on my previous post. [See above]

----------


## RTR13

> Interesting, most of what you described sounds just like what I've been going through too, with the exception of feeling cold; for me it's the opposite, I get hot flashes and night sweats. I've been on Synthroid for sometime now, 200mcg daily, and it's helped some but it wasn't until I got my E2 under control that I noticed the greatest improvement. It was *way* out of whack, 167, and after a month or so of Arimidex , it's now 47 and I feel *much* better. More energy, much clearer thinking, sleeping better and my eyes even feel better too.
> 
> What about your libido and overall sexual performance? How's that? Everything you mentioned sure sounds like thyroid, but is there anything else your feeling that you didn't mention? I'm just reaching for straws here because your numbers seem to indicate you're fine but clearly your symptoms don't. 
> *
> Question to the board:*
> I'm just throwing this out there but, is it possible for someone to have normal T levels and still have elevated E2; which could cause his symptoms?
> 
> Then again, maybe you're just one of those lucky people who falls outside the norm and regardless of your "numbers" you still have the symptoms and need to get on some thyroid treatment? You can always try what I did which was to simply ask my Dr. if it couldn't hurt to just *try* some low dose thyroid treatment for a couple months just to see how I respond. That's what finally did it for me. If your current doctor wont help you, then I say move on until you find someone who will.




Sorry about the late reply! A lot of things have been going on around here lately, so I haven't been able to get online...

Sex drive has been VERY minimal. I mean, I feel bad for my girlfriend. She wants to, but I just don't have the will really. Nothing really "gets me going" anymore. Every once in a while, say after about 2/3 weeks of not doing *anything*, I get in a mood for a little while, but it doesn't last long.

What's E2? Sorry, this is all new to me..

Now I did have a *few* hot flashes, if you could call them that. I would be sitting down and from my neck up, I'd feel like I had a fever, but my feet were frozen. I'd check my temp thinking "I'm getting sick", and it would be around 97.5 or so. Happens once in a while, but not as often anymore. It'll feel like my cheeks are really hot, then after about 30 minutes, it's gone.

----------


## forrest_and_trees

E2 = Estradiol = Estrogen. 

As I suspected, it's sounding like you *may* have elevated estrogen levels. Normal amounts in men are necessary for your libido and sexual performance among other things. Too much can: lower your libido, effect your sexual performance, cause water retention, foggy thinking, fatigue, insomnia, moodiness, anxiety, depression, pain in your body, weight gain, "man boobs", prostate problems, urinary problems, allergies, hot flashes, night sweats, etc. The fatigue could be effecting your eyes. I had the same problem. 

I'd explain the situation to your doc and ask to have your Estradiol levels checked. 

If it's high, the good news is you can get meds to lower the levels to normal and get you back in the game. If your Testosterone levels are already normal, you may be one of the lucky ones and forego TRT which is a *lifetime* commitment.

----------


## RTR13

> E2 = Estradiol = Estrogen. 
> 
> As I suspected, it's sounding like you *may* have high estrogen levels. Normal amounts in men are necessary for your libido and sexual performance among other things. Too much can: lower your libido, effect your sexual performance, cause water retention, foggy thinking, fatigue, insomnia, moodiness, anxiety, depression, pain in your body, weight gain, "man boobs", prostate problems, urinary problems, allergies, hot flashes, night sweats, etc. The fatigue could be effecting your eyes. I had the same problem. 
> 
> I'd explain the situation to your doc and ask to have your Estradiol levels checked. 
> 
> If it's high, the good news is you can get meds to lower the levels to normal and get you back in the game. If your Testosterone levels are already normal, you may be one of the lucky ones and forego TRT which is a *lifetime* commitment.


Thank you so much! I will definitely suggest that to my doctor on my next visit. I had come to the conclusion that I was basically going to walk in and demand 25mcg of Synthroid for a trial period to see if that helped, but I'll have them test my Estradiol levels first.

I have to say too that, if you felt/feel as bad as I have the last 6 months, I am truly sorry. This has been awful. It's affected my everyday life dramatically.

Just a random question while I'm thinking about it: could drinking a lot of soy milk cause estradiol elevation? I ask because, for about a month or so prior to me feeling awful, I was drinking this chocolate soy milk every day, often 3/4 cartons of it a week. As soon as I started feeling sick, I quit drinking it and started drinking more water.

----------


## forrest_and_trees

I'm no expert on the subject however, from what I understand, soy is a natural source of estrogen and often recommended to menopausal women and women dealing with estrogen deficiency. 

Here's some additional info on Soy and Estrogen Dominance.

It's hard to tell for sure the exact cause because now days there are *many* sources of estrogen-like materials called Xenoestrogens, all around us. I did a quick search and came up with the following:

*Xenoestrogens* are a type of foreign (often man-made) substance called endocrine disruptors that mimic the behavior of estrogen in the body. They are found in many everyday household substances, including foods, and a growing number of scientists believe that they are one of the main contributing factors to the growing epidemic of estrogen dominance around the world. For many people, the most common sources include meat and dairy products raised with the use of growth hormones, chemical pesticides and herbicides consumed on food or used in the home or garden, certain types of plastic products, and certain types of health and beauty products. To learn more about how to avoid xenoestrogens, read Reducing Exposure to Xenoestrogens.

FYI- If you do indeed have elevated estrogen levels, you may have a little difficulty getting your doctor to write you a script for an estrogen reducer, often referred to as an anti-aromatis or Aromatis Inhibitor or AI. Most docs are unfamiliar with them. There are some "natural" AI's but they are usually not very effective. Then again, in your case they may work just fine. If not, come back here and do some more digging around. There is quite a bit of information on the subject and it may be necessary to provide some to your doc to get the ball rolling. 

Best of luck!

----------


## bbrock

Have you checked your blood sugar and your blood pressure. Allot of your symptoms sound like diabetes. Sometimes you can have two or three things going on at the same time especially when it comes to hormones.

----------


## RTR13

> Have you checked your blood sugar and your blood pressure. Allot of your symptoms sound like diabetes. Sometimes you can have two or three things going on at the same time especially when it comes to hormones.


Yeah, they checked it several times, and I've actually monitored it myself using a home meter (a family member has diabetes and gave me their old monitor just to rule that out). I would check it several hours before and after eating. Had another test done to check for a longer duration of time to see what the average was (I think that's how it worked), and it was really good. I worried about diabetes myself, actually, because diabetes and thyroid problems run in the family.

----------


## durak

You should also request (demand) free t3 and free t4 be measured. All the t3 in the world is worthless if it is all bound and not free to work in the body.

You can get T3 from ar-r at a fair price.

If you need help with a Dr for the thyroid I can help. These Drs would be real Drs not "clinics" or mail order.

----------


## RTR13

Just a quick update: My TSH was slightly elevated, and my B12 was pretty low, so they've started me on B12 shots for a couple of months to see how well it does. They're going to check for a few other things, but the dr seems pretty confident that the B12 is what's affecting my energy and such.

----------


## ericzacha

Just so everyone is clear, because it seemed a bit muddied in the thread. 

TSH is thyroid stimulating hormone. It is in a negative feedback loop with T3/T4 such that if your TSH levels are low, it means your T3/T4 levels are high. If your TSH levels are high it means T3/T4 are low. Both T3 and T4 are bound by thyroid binding globulin (TBG). The majority of thyroid hormone produced in the thyroid is T4. But T4 is not taken up well peripherally and is generally converted to the more potent T3 by 5'-deiodinase. This is a general summary, obviously there is much more to it. 

If this was all understood already, please accept my apologies for stepping in.

----------


## kenshiro

My TSH came to ...1.16 uIU/ml for Test 1 
Test 2.................1.65 uIU/ml (0.450-4.500)
Free T4 in test 2...1.50 ng/dl (0.82-1.77)
B12.....................1770 pg/ml ( 211-946)
Maybe this could have something to do with my hypogonadism? Although i've never had my T3 tested so far....

stats :-
Age 25
Height 6 feet 0 inches
Weight 180-185 lbs
bf % 14-16 roughly

----------

