# COMPETITIVE BODYBUILDING - POWERLIFTING - ATHLETICS & SPORTS > POWERLIFTING FORUM >  steroids vs. supplements

## quarry206

ok i made this arguement the other day and to be honest i feel like i was wrong but i'm asking the forums opinion

i'm about to go on my third tour to iraq, this time in a non-combat MOS so me and my friends are really using this year to do nothing but work out..

here is the debate:

they want to do cycles of test C about 200-400 a wk.. i say that mixing creatine, NO, protien and a good multi V (proper diet too of course) you can equal the effects of steroids at those low dosages..

i do feel i might be wrong, i have never done juice. so maybe i'm just an idoit on the topic. but just for informational reasons, i'm kinda wondering if i was totally wrong in my arguement.

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## Deltasaurus

400MG of test vs supps test wins

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## redz

No contest....test wins flat out.

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## Big

I don't see anything about powerlifting here, off to the lounge it goes...

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## Maverick_J8

> ok i made this arguement the other day and to be honest i feel like i was wrong but i'm asking the forums opinion
> 
> i'm about to go on my third tour to iraq, this time in a non-combat MOS so me and my friends are really using this year to do nothing but work out..
> 
> here is the debate:
> 
> they want to do cycles of test C about 200-400 a wk.. i say that mixing creatine, NO, protien and a good multi V (proper diet too of course) you can equal the effects of steroids at those low dosages..
> 
> i do feel i might be wrong, i have never done juice. so maybe i'm just an idoit on the topic. but just for informational reasons, i'm kinda wondering if i was totally wrong in my arguement.



Creatine, NO, protein and a good multi vit, proper diet = 10lbs of muscle (muscle not fat), approx 6 month, if not more. 

10 weeks of Test/proper diet = 20+ lbs of pure muscle. Not to mention the strength.

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## quarry206

> I don't see anything about powerlifting here, off to the lounge it goes...



well my question was geared towards powerlifting gains.. not muscle/body building.. thats why i put it in the powerlifting section... my personal goals have never been anything other than lifting more weight in the big three.. not having bigger biceps.

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## Big

> well my question was geared towards powerlifting gains.. not muscle/body building.. thats why i put it in the powerlifting section... my personal goals have never been anything other than lifting more weight in the big three.. not having bigger biceps.


fair enough I'll leave it, but if you read the original post you can probably see where my confusion came from.

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## stpete

You might have a leg to stand on if the test is at 200 ew. I wouldn't even bother with that low low dose. But if it's at 400, probably different story.

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## smokeyd

i think even at 200 a week your going to smoke someone who does everything you do only no test

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## audis4

> ok i made this arguement the other day and to be honest i feel like i was wrong but i'm asking the forums opinion
> 
> i'm about to go on my third tour to iraq, this time in a non-combat MOS so me and my friends are really using this year to do nothing but work out..
> 
> here is the debate:
> 
> they want to do cycles of test C about 200-400 a wk.. i say that mixing creatine, NO, protien and a good multi V (proper diet too of course) you can equal the effects of steroids at those low dosages..
> 
> i do feel i might be wrong, i have never done juice. so maybe i'm just an idoit on the topic. but just for informational reasons, i'm kinda wondering if i was totally wrong in my arguement.


aren't you benching 500+?? and you've never done a cycle?

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## quarry206

> aren't you benching 500+?? and you've never done a cycle?


never had a meet lift of 500.. best was 475lbs @198 at a local meet here in gainesville,fl and matched that weight in a balad,iraq for a military meet but i weighed 215lb ... no i have never done a cycle, i will have to be honest and say i have done clen /t3, but really that was for weight loss two years ago not meet prep.

i usually take protein three shakes of optimum protein powder
take creatine stack by twinlabs
injectable B-12 from time to time
when i have the money i put NO2 for 8 wks or so at a time

my wife only cooks chicken and vegetables with once or twice a week having fast food. so i keep some what healthy. and a low stress life style. which i believe is a major help

i have mainly been only a presser. but major goal is to come back (october 09) and do a full meet because i feel i have very strong legs and back just need to train on form for squat and dead... and thats where the debate all started because the guys i'm going to be training with want test. i'm 26 so i feel my body still has a few years before i need to look for more help. i'm at least going to try to be juice free a little longer

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## Doc.Sust

nothing beets test,nothing that is legal

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## audis4

> never had a meet lift of 500.. best was 475lbs @198 at a local meet here in gainesville,fl and matched that weight in a balad,iraq for a military meet but i weighed 215lb ... no i have never done a cycle, i will have to be honest and say i have done clen /t3, but really that was for weight loss two years ago not meet prep.
> 
> i usually take protein three shakes of optimum protein powder
> take creatine stack by twinlabs
> injectable B-12 from time to time
> when i have the money i put NO2 for 8 wks or so at a time
> 
> my wife only cooks chicken and vegetables with once or twice a week having fast food. so i keep some what healthy. and a low stress life style. which i believe is a major help
> 
> i have mainly been only a presser. but major goal is to come back (october 09) and do a full meet because i feel i have very strong legs and back just need to train on form for squat and dead... and thats where the debate all started because the guys i'm going to be training with want test. i'm 26 so i feel my body still has a few years before i need to look for more help. i'm at least going to try to be juice free a little longer


very strong bro! Ya, if your pressing 475, I would try to get at least a 500lbs raw press before jumping on anything  :Smilie: 
Keep at it bro! I wouldn't consider clen/t3 a cycle, not for gaining anyways  :Smilie:

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## redz

475 is a pretty great natural accomplishment!

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## RJstrong

No comparison here... supplements can play an important role, but the power of test or any other compound (even at a low dose) wins hands down.

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## boondockSAINT

Well, I definitely think test for you will outdeul any combination of legal supplements. And I'm not sure where your argument was directed, but with your background it certainly seems that you can make better gains on legal supplements than most people gain on steroids . But if you are talking about test gains from training partners of your caliber vs your legal supplement gains then yes I think you are mistaken. 

All discussion aside, you have some ridiculous accomplishments under your belt. Congrats man. Keep up the hard work whichever way you choose to go.

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## Devildogjoe

jay cutler

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## Devildogjoe

only uses creatine

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## 200byjune

ya but why wouldnt you use that stuff anyway? lol. 200mgs of test c would result in results a slight bit better but is it worth it when you have to do pct and lose some of those gains or just maintain for a few weeks. i say 200mgs of test c = supps

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