# MEMBERS EXPERIENCES > TRAINING/DIET/CYCLE ACCOUNTABILITY LOGS >  HoldMyBeer bruh

## HoldMyBeer

Alright. This log is going to be boring as fuck. But I need it. I am at the end of my rope and grasping at straws. I've been yoyoing between 20-25% BF for 2 years now. Seriously about to give up on trying to become a bodybuilder. IDK, the gym and training is the only thing that keeps me sane these days. It's the only thing that, for that short period of time while at the gym, relieves the weight of the world from my shoulders (funny how adding actual weight, relieves metaphorical weight). But insanity is insanity. Doing the same thing.. results... blah blah blah. It's ridiculous. One last push will decide it. A little over a month, I am fucking trowing the kitchen sink at it. DNP , clen , tren , fucking everything. If I dont hit my goal (180lbs) by Jan 18th... idk... I am going to have to re-evaluate shit.
The main thing is, I am question if I have the discipline required. When the week goes well and my routine isnt fucked up, I am great and stick to my diet. The weekends I fucking go off. I outeat the DNP 10 fold. 
Last Thursday I was 200.8. All this is just my dinner, I had normal pwo meals, post wo meals, lunch, and snacks on top of that. 
Friday I went out to all-you-can-eat sushi late (1 Rice ball, 3 Crab Rangoons, 3 Dumplings, About 40 pieces of sushi, 2 maki rolls). So before hand I had a small dinner (8oz chicken and broccoli). Then got cupcakes and ate the whole pack and a protein bar. 
The next night (saturday), I ate a large pizza, 2 pb&js, 1 peanutbutter and banana sandwich, blueberry bagel, 2 protein bars
Last night (Sunday), I ate a whole pizza, whole calzone, and 5 doughnuts. 
This morning: 209.4 lbs. I will diet all week (again), and Thursday I will be about 200lbs flat.
NORMALLY, this would only happen one night a week. So I can maintain my BF pretty easily. Making progress is the difficult part for me. DNP is a bitch, your body craves carbs, so you eat a shit ton, but it just makes you hot and uncomfortable and you still crave carbs. So these cheat meals are not doing what a cheat meal is supposed to be doing. Which is why it's 3 nights a week as opposed to one. But it's also what has allowed me to burn off all that shit and still make a little progress. I just need to get my act together and I can make a lot of progress.

IDK what this log is going to be, I just know its necessary. If I do post what I eat, it will seem off, but thats not what I would normally eat, it changed because of the DNP (ie lots of fruits and fast acting carbs instead of complex, or very little carbs that are only fruit, etc). I do not post pics of myself online. My workouts are full-body A or B MWF. Steady-state cardio TuThSa. Abs Tu and Sa (used to be on all cardio days, but started to cause an imbalance). I dislike the routine (doing cardio and fullbody workouts), but fat-loss is the goal. I probably wont post those because they never change and I NEVER fail to get to the gym. I just need some accountability on the weekends I guess. I track my weight on my phone, but it may be good to post it here too. Fuuuuuck. Like I said, grasping at straws here

----------


## charger69

I do not know the whole situation, but it sounds like you are trying to use the chemicals to lose weight. I think your issue is your diet. 
On a proper diet, you should never feel hungry. 
I think you could also make some changes to your training, but the diet is the key.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

----------


## Couchlockd

Stop the dnp before you end up killing yourself.

It's doing no good for you.

It's wasted with no benifit. Thus is the cold hard truth. Your one of my friends here.

----------


## Obs

Aye....

No worries brother.
Phentermine and ephedrine.
Start using gear as a mechanism to prevent muscle wasting in times of caloric deficit.

You know how boards are though everyone is just going to say diet diet diet.

Go get some bronkaid and see about ordering phentermine. I appreciate the fact that I dont have bf issues but kinda understand that some dont have it so easy. 

Bronkaid dosed fairly heavy with acidic urine will keep your apetite beat down all day. Focus on protein and clean carbs for your meal at the end of the day and you will start dropping. 

If you need any help contact me. 
I would have a chat about dosage with me before starting. 

Remember many AAS were primarily used to help sick people prevent muscle wasting. Yes diet is an important factor. Chemicals make it easier though. 
May not be safer but who am I to judge.

Tarzan is a prime example.
Guy looks like a natural born mack truck and everyone said he was too high bf to be cycling. Well, Tarzan said he would not have done it without juice and he did a great job so I will take his word for it. Bear in mind the guy eats deep fried food and barbeque.

Steroids makes everything better. 
Stimulants are pretty kick ass too.

----------


## Obs

If you rid yourself of apetite whatsoever, add in juice to prevent muscle loss, and pretty much do what you feel.... 
You will lose weight. 
Safety is #1 though, to some people, who like being safe, and average, and are gonna live forever.

----------


## balance

HMB

Glad to see you starting a log, I’ll be following for sure. Everyone is a little different and finding what works for you is your key. The fact you enjoy lifting/exercise is a huge indicator you are in this for the long term (don’t kid yourself with short term I’m going to reach this certain goal by blah blah blah). You honestly sound like you enjoy this why give it up, what else are you going to do take up knitting? Have you looked into knitting forums?

Seriously though if you are doing something (dnp ) that is counterproductive to your goal don’t do it. Example for me in the past when I try to drop weight I would try adding lots of cardio in. This for me did not work, as it made my cravings too strong and I overate. Whereas with limited/or no cardio I can truly control my diet (was doing IF for many months only eating in a 4 hour window). I will say I drank a lot of coffee then. Just as Obs mentioned E or ECA works really well for most and it suppresses hunger for most people too. 

Sounds crazy but what about only posting pics/listing 
the really poor food choices. Sounds crazy however I bet it would really make you think about having focus on consuming only things that are productive towards goal. 

Either way I will be here following along. Looking forward to watching your progress. 

b

----------


## Couchlockd

> HMB
> 
> Glad to see you starting a log, I’ll be following for sure. Everyone is a little different and finding what works for you is your key. The fact you enjoy lifting/exercise is a huge indicator you are in this for the long term (don’t kid yourself with short term I’m going to reach this certain goal by blah blah blah). You honestly sound like you enjoy this why give it up, what else are you going to do take up knitting? Have you looked into knitting forums?
> 
> Seriously though if you are doing something (dnp ) that is counterproductive to your goal don’t do it. Example for me in the past when I try to drop weight I would try adding lots of cardio in. This for me did not work, as it made my cravings too strong and I overate. Whereas with limited/or no cardio I can truly control my diet (was doing IF for many months only eating in a 4 hour window). I will say I drank a lot of coffee then. Just as Obs mentioned E or ECA works really well for most and it suppresses hunger for most people too. 
> 
> Sounds crazy but what about only posting pics/listing 
> the really poor food choices. Sounds crazy however I bet it would really make you think about having focus on consuming only things that are productive towards goal. 
> 
> ...


Same with me, cardio and a deficit make me kill the fridge at night 

Dnp i hear can cause 3xtreme cravings.

----------


## HoldMyBeer

I appreciate the worry everyone. But I'm being stubborn. I have 39 days to hit my goal if it fucking kills me. Its happening. I can yoyo on the BF all I want once I am in the range I want to be. This has been my goal for years now, the deadline isn't changing
I've tried t3, t4, clen , etc. History has proven I do not have the will power to be consistent enough in the diet. So let's test the fuck out of it. If I can't do it, maybe bodybuilding isn't for me. 
Don't mistake me tone. I am not depressed and defeated. I am fucking pissed. This shits happening. 39 days of feeling shitty and I'm there. I just need to keep my weekends in check

Sent from my LG-LS993 using Tapatalk

----------


## HoldMyBeer

I crushed this mornings workout. 
I may switch to a upper/lower split, cuz cardio sucks. One less day of cardio is a win in my book

Monday upper
Tu lower
Wed cardio abs
Th upper
Fr lower
Sa cardio abs

Sent from my LG-LS993 using Tapatalk

----------


## kelkel

> I have 39 days to hit my goal if it fucking kills me.



I may have missed it but what happens in 39 days?

----------


## charger69

> I appreciate the worry everyone. But I'm being stubborn. I have 39 days to hit my goal if it fucking kills me. Its happening. I can yoyo on the BF all I want once I am in the range I want to be. This has been my goal for years now, the deadline isn't changing
> I've tried t3, t4, clen , etc. History has proven I do not have the will power to be consistent enough in the diet. So let's test the fuck out of it. If I can't do it, maybe bodybuilding isn't for me. 
> Don't mistake me tone. I am not depressed and defeated. I am fucking pissed. This shits happening. 39 days of feeling shitty and I'm there. I just need to keep my weekends in check
> 
> Sent from my LG-LS993 using Tapatalk


If you REALLY want it, you will get it.
At 46, I was 240 lbs and probably 30% bf. I set a goal to compete the following year because I could not lose weight. In 9 months I got down to 165 all natural. 
I did cardio 2x day and was on a strict diet. 
NOTE: Diet is more than counting calories. 
Now- that just shows that it can be done naturally. 
I am not against using things to assist. 
Once again, on a diet, you should not be hungry. Try eating 6 x day in small portions. You do need to resist temptation. Allow one cheat meal per week. 
Note: because it was all natural, I did look a little anorexic. I did not have anything to preserve muscle. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

----------


## HoldMyBeer

> I may have missed it but what happens in 39 days?


That was the goal date I set for myself way back when.
Occupation change on day 40 also, and I don't want to be juggling dnp and a bunch of other shit during it. I want to be at my goal and not distracted

Sent from my LG-LS993 using Tapatalk

----------


## Proximal

> I appreciate the worry everyone. But I'm being stubborn. I have 39 days to hit my goal if it fucking kills me. Its happening. I can yoyo on the BF all I want once I am in the range I want to be. This has been my goal for years now, the deadline isn't changing
> I've tried t3, t4, clen , etc. History has proven I do not have the will power to be consistent enough in the diet. So let's test the fuck out of it. If I can't do it, maybe bodybuilding isn't for me. 
> Don't mistake me tone. I am not depressed and defeated. I am fucking pissed. This shits happening. 39 days of feeling shitty and I'm there. I just need to keep my weekends in check
> 
> Sent from my LG-LS993 using Tapatalk


Fucking pissed is a mind-set thats always worked for me. I am trying to get there right now & will be my turning point. 

TY for the thread, very interested.

----------


## EDCG19

6-8 hour eating window is what you need. 
Inteminent fasting works

----------


## EDCG19

> If you REALLY want it, you will get it.
> At 46, I was 240 lbs and probably 30% bf. I set a goal to compete the following year because I could not lose weight. In 9 months I got down to 165 all natural. 
> I did cardio 2x day and was on a strict diet. 
> NOTE: Diet is more than counting calories. 
> Now- that just shows that it can be done naturally. 
> I am not against using things to assist. 
> Once again, on a diet, you should not be hungry. Try eating 6 x day in small portions. You do need to resist temptation. Allow one cheat meal per week. 
> Note: because it was all natural, I did look a little anorexic. I did not have anything to preserve muscle. 
> 
> ...


Any loose skin or at this point it doesn't really matter

----------


## charger69

> Any loose skin or at this point it doesn't really matter


Yes, but I compete and I am able to get around it. It has been getting better but I usually do RF on the abs before competition. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

----------


## HoldMyBeer

I got here by not setting short term goals. So let's fix that 
This morning I was 209
206 by Friday morning

Sent from my LG-LS993 using Tapatalk

----------


## SocioMachiavelli

Hey brother,

I think the issue you are having with your discipline is partly because of the methods you are using. There have already been some good suggestions like intermittent fasting you could a 14 hour fast and ten hours for meals or a 16:8 ratio.

Intermittent fasting kills my appetite and prevents me from gorging on food. 

There is a painful reality to your situation though, if you are going full tilt with the fat burners etc and not dropping the weight... You aren't working hard enough in the gym or the cardio. Your output has to outweigh your input

If you are going to eat like that, you have to earn it in your workouts and cardio... The evidence suggests you're not.

I heard something the otherday that really resonated with me.... Everybody in life have things that they want... But you don't get what you want, you get what you have to have. 

If you don't do it with all the fat burners you are throwing at it.. You really didn't want it bad enough, it's not about saying it... It's about doing it. 

So.. How bad do you want it?... Don't answer it now, answer it after the 39 days.

----------


## SocioMachiavelli

> I got here by not setting short term goals. So let's fix that 
> This morning I was 209
> 206 by Friday morning
> 
> Sent from my LG-LS993 using Tapatalk


Atta boy. Write that shit down

----------


## HoldMyBeer

So a lot of that 209 was water weight. I actually expect to be 200 by Friday. But I can't say that for sure, and don't want to set goal that I don't end up achieving because I was speculating on water weight.
That being said, 203.8 today, so let's reevaluate my goal for Friday (which is now 201.5)
Cardio/abs soon. Need to eat quick. Then start push/pull tomorrow

Sent from my LG-LS993 using Tapatalk

----------


## Stalker3060

Good luck buddy I'll "hold your beer" while you kill it

----------


## HoldMyBeer

So 200.2 this morning. I lost the water weight faster than I expected. This is where I was last Thursday. So reevaluating Fridays goal again. 198.7
I was thinking, if I am going to lost weight so quickly. It may be beneficial to add a REASONABLE cheat-meal (not 2 large pizzas and a bunch of cookies and shit) every 5th day or so. That way I am not comepletely crashing and go off the rails. I can't tell if that's just the fat kid in me trying to trick me into letting him out. I'll have to think about it (feedback appreciated)
Currently, I am taking
200 trenE /week
300 testC /week. The goal here is to minimize muscle loss as much as possible.
Clen 2 days on 2 days off
Ephedrine on the clen off days
500mg dnp /day
Eventually, if I start to fall behind my goal, I will throw in t3 or 4. And up the dnp. Dnp can't stay too high for too long though as the hives become unbearable

I have 2 different diet plans that I rotate:
One (I forget the ratios) ends up being 
325g protein, 125g carbs, 55g fat
The other
225g protein, 265g carbs, 45g fat
Both have a 250-500 cal deficit.
Usually you want to keep the fat as low as possible. 
I eat 7 times a day. Pwo, breakfast post workout, late morning snack, noon snack, lunch, dinner 1, dinner 2.

Sent from my LG-LS993 using Tapatalk

----------


## Obs

In every thing I have been successful at (not much) 
I literally turn it into a punishment until productive behavior becomes the norm.

Between aggression and replacement behavior is where my progress comes. 
When I feel strongly like cheating or giving up, I punish myself with extra burden. I dont think a cheat meal can be anything but counterproductive. That being said though, weight loss is never something I have attempted or needed to. 

I suppose it will be individual specific

----------


## Chrisp83TRT

Fasted cardio bro and IF with some nice tren A added some displined diet and killer training and you'll be in six pack shape by the new year brother ! 

You got this 

Sent from my JSN-AL00 using Tapatalk

----------


## HoldMyBeer

199.0 this morning
Sunday goal -> 197.0

Sent from my LG-LS993 using Tapatalk

----------


## HoldMyBeer

Only 1 more day until Friday. Easy game. Let's get it!

Sent from my LG-LS993 using Tapatalk

----------


## Obs

Heck yeah!
Good job man!

----------


## Proximal

> 199.0 this morning
> Sunday goal -> 197.0
> 
> Sent from my LG-LS993 using Tapatalk


Nice steady progress! Keep it going!

----------


## HoldMyBeer

199.2 this morning (+ 0.2) 
Can't freak out though, give it a couple days and see what happens.

Can we all agree tho, cardiB needs to stop making music and fuck off?

Sent from my LG-LS993 using Tapatalk

----------


## kelkel

Unfortunately I had to google cardiB.....

----------


## HoldMyBeer

> Unfortunately I had to google cardiB.....


Sorry to do that to you! You were better off never finding out. She's all over the radio, especially at the gym, featured on a ton of songs that would otherwise be good. Can't stand her

Sent from my LG-LS993 using Tapatalk

----------


## Couchlockd

> Sorry to do that to you! You were better off never finding out. She's all over the radio, especially at the gym, featured on a ton of songs that would otherwise be good. Can't stand her
> 
> Sent from my LG-LS993 using Tapatalk


Jesus Christ.

She's a female mumble rap hype man thing.

Please don't get confused, she's not making music, never has and never will.

She makes bird and machine gun sounds through auto tune over a cheaply produced fruity loops beat.

----------


## Proximal

I'd like the 90 seconds of my life back that I took to search & then listen to a bit of her "song". 

This is the reason I am going deaf. I have to play my metal so loudly in order to drown out that crap in the gym.

----------


## SocioMachiavelli

How can you go to the gym without earphones?

----------


## Obs

> How can you go to the gym without earphones?


I forgot mine once.
Sat crying for 15 min before I got it together.

----------


## HoldMyBeer

> How can you go to the gym without earphones?


I never do. I keep wired ones in the car in case I forget them. But it's that few minutes walking in/out that gets yah

Sent from my LG-LS993 using Tapatalk

----------


## HoldMyBeer

199.6 this morning. + 0.6 since Thursday... Still trying to not be frustrated. It will be quite disheartening when I do not hit my goal I set for Sunday. I have not strayed from the diet, and I have been in a calorie deficit.
Have to wait until Thursday then I can increase the DNP and add T3. 
Time to go crush legs. Have a good morning everyone!

Sent from my LG-LS993 using Tapatalk

----------


## Proximal

> 199.6 this morning. + 0.6 since Thursday... Still trying to not be frustrated. It will be quite disheartening when I do not hit my goal I set for Sunday. I have not strayed from the diet, and I have been in a calorie deficit.
> Have to wait until Thursday then I can increase the DNP and add T3. 
> Time to go crush legs. Have a good morning everyone!
> 
> Sent from my LG-LS993 using Tapatalk


I’m the same way many times with the scale. Then get frustrated if the weight loss doesn’t happen in a perfectly linear fashion. I have to remind myself to keep focused on doing the right things, because if I do, it WILL happen. Hope you have a killer workout!

----------


## HoldMyBeer

Alright. 199.6 again. Didn't hit my Sunday goal. Pissed.
So I think I'm only actually at 2600-2700 tdee, and I'm eating 2400-2500 calories. So there's a smaller deficit than I expected. I didn't take into account how I have been more sedentary throughout the day.... 
Once again, starting Thursday, fucking putting that body fat in it's place. Throwing in more chemicals, adding some LISS in between dinner 1 and 2. 

Sent from my LG-LS993 using Tapatalk

----------


## SocioMachiavelli

Why thursday?

----------


## balance

I saw your posted different macro plans above but was wondering what kind of meals are you eating? What are some of your staple proteins, carbs, fats? How often are you eating meals you didn’t prep (eating out)?

----------


## HoldMyBeer

> Why thursday?


Just have a lot of personal stuff going on. Need to be functional until then

Sent from my LG-LS993 using Tapatalk

----------


## HoldMyBeer

> I saw your posted different macro plans above but was wondering what kind of meals are you eating? What are some of your staple proteins, carbs, fats? How often are you eating meals you didnt prep (eating out)?


Currently, because of DNP , I am eating more simple carbs (faster carbs = less time burning up sweating my balls off)
Current meal plan as it is more satiating:
-Non fat Greek yogurt, blueberries
-2 eggs, 5 egg whites, bagel post (w a little smart balance lite to keep the fat down)
-2 slices white bread, 2 servings tuna (lite miracle whip), baby spinach, pickles
-2 slices white bread, 5oz turkey, baby spinach, pickles, mustard
-2 servings pasta, 6 oz chicken breast, 2 servings broccoli
-6 oz chicken, 2 servings broccoli

Sent from my LG-LS993 using Tapatalk

----------


## GearHeaded

just my thought and opinion here.. but when running DNP you would be better of 'backloading' your carbs until post workout only and taking them in with exogenous insulin . that way you can actually utilize them to help fill muscle glycogen stores, rather then burning them off as heat throughout the day.

example. 
if your diet calls for 100g of carbs for the day. then take all 100g of those carbs in your post workout meal with 10iu of insulin.

while running DNP your beta cells in the pancreas have limited to no ability to produce insulin. when you consume carbs with every meal throughout the day your blood sugar just keeps rising. The DNP is making you throw off 'heat' as the primary way of utilizing these carbs.

by taking in exogenous insulin post workout when Glut 4 levels are high , your going to be able to drive these carbs, amino acids, water, creatine, etc.. into muscle cells. instead of just burning them up as heat all day.

----------


## HoldMyBeer

> just my thought and opinion here.. but when running DNP you would be better of 'backloading' your carbs until post workout only and taking them in with exogenous insulin . that way you can actually utilize them to help fill muscle glycogen stores, rather then burning them off as heat throughout the day.
> 
> example. 
> if your diet calls for 100g of carbs for the day. then take all 100g of those carbs in your post workout meal with 10iu of insulin.
> 
> while running DNP your beta cells in the pancreas have limited to no ability to produce insulin. when you consume carbs with every meal throughout the day your blood sugar just keeps rising. The DNP is making you throw off 'heat' as the primary way of utilizing these carbs.
> 
> by taking in exogenous insulin post workout when Glut 4 levels are high , your going to be able to drive these carbs, amino acids, water, creatine, etc.. into muscle cells. instead of just burning them up as heat all day.


So I would assume I want a fast actng insulin
Suggestions on which one?

Sent from my LG-LS993 using Tapatalk

----------


## GearHeaded

> So I would assume I want a fast actng insulin 
> Suggestions on which one?
> 
> Sent from my LG-LS993 using Tapatalk


a fast acting or a regular acting insulin will both do the job.. purchasing 'regular' acting insulin like Novalin R is generally easier then purchasing fast acting insulin like humalog, as the novalin r doesn't require a prescription and can be purchased over the counter at Walmart (in most states).
but with the internet obviously they are both fairly available like anything else

----------


## HoldMyBeer

No progress the past few days. Dialing it up.
https://ytcropper.com/cropped/Hp5c1ad19e5873f

----------


## HoldMyBeer

197.6, so I'm starting to make progress again.
Just cranked everything up yesterday so I expect the progress to continue from here on out (minus Monday/Tuesday, obviously have family stuff, need to be a functioning human being)

Sent from my LG-LS993 using Tapatalk

----------


## HoldMyBeer

194.4 this morning. Been sweating buckets , probably a lot of water weight.
I'm going to crush that fucking goal. Just need to double up on the ECA stack this morning because I didn't sleep at all last night. And we're not going to let that get in the way of moving some weights around now are we?!
Christmas Eve in a couple days. That's exciting. Love seeing family, can't wait

Sent from my LG-LS993 using Tapatalk

----------


## Obs

> 194.4 this morning. Been sweating buckets , probably a lot of water weight.
> I'm going to crush that fucking goal. Just need to double up on the ECA stack this morning because I didn't sleep at all last night
> 
> Sent from my LG-LS993 using Tapatalk


Damn!
You are gonna crush that goal! Careful with the eca!
Aside from dehydration it can cause heart attack and stroke in a healthy guy

----------


## HoldMyBeer

192.4 this morning.
I need to ease it up the next couple days, I need to be a functioning human being for family stuff.
I expect to add about 6-7 lbs (mostly water weight) during that time. By next Sunday that should be gone and I hope to have cracked 190. 
I am currently leaner than I have been ... In over a decade. I find it very hard for me to lose fat, where putting on muscle is easy (for me).

Sent from my LG-LS993 using Tapatalk

----------


## charger69

> Damn!
> You are gonna crush that goal! Careful with the eca!
> Aside from dehydration it can cause heart attack and stroke in a healthy guy


You are one to talk on the ECA!

Well then, if HMB is not healthy, then there is nothing to worry about! LOL


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

----------


## Obs

> You are one to talk on the ECA!
> 
> Well then, if HMB is not healthy, then there is nothing to worry about! LOL
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I am specialthough
I have done it for... 15 years?
I know how much I can take and everything not to mix ot with.

----------


## Obs

> 192.4 this morning.
> I need to ease it up the next couple days, I need to be a functioning human being for family stuff.
> I expect to add about 6-7 lbs (mostly water weight) during that time. By next Sunday that should be gone and I hope to have cracked 190. 
> I am currently leaner than I have been ... In over a decade. I find it very hard for me to lose fat, where putting on muscle is easy (for me).
> 
> Sent from my LG-LS993 using Tapatalk


Damn good progress!

----------


## Proximal

> 192.4 this morning.
> I need to ease it up the next couple days, I need to be a functioning human being for family stuff.
> I expect to add about 6-7 lbs (mostly water weight) during that time. By next Sunday that should be gone and I hope to have cracked 190. 
> I am currently leaner than I have been ... In over a decade. I find it very hard for me to lose fat, where putting on muscle is easy (for me).
> 
> Sent from my LG-LS993 using Tapatalk


Congrats on the progress dude!

----------


## HoldMyBeer

> I am specialthough
> I have done it for... 15 years?
> I know how much I can take and everything not to mix ot with.


That ECA stack was a good suggestion. Really helps curb the apatite (which was my biggest issue, no matter how I tried to structure my diet, always hungry). Thank you.

----------


## Obs

> That ECA stack was a good suggestion. Really helps curb the apatite (which was my biggest issue, no matter how I tried to structure my diet, always hungry). Thank you.


No prob.
Dont run it too long.
They say it is not habit forming but they are stupid.
It is a next level stimulant and all stimulants can be habit forming. I feel like hammered shit for a few days when I cease it.

----------


## Obs

You should love a good dose with a bunch of caffeine preworkout.
Trick is to drink a monster or redbull, wait 30 minutes and dose your Epedrine. Then drink another redbull or monster gradually. 

The energy drinks contain a high inorganic acid content. This will raise your urine Ph levels and extend the half life of the drug by up to double. 
You will get full kick all day. 

If you time it right when you go to piss after the second drink, your hair will stand on end and tingle. 

Even though it is a vasoconstrictor you will get the most God awful pump from it imaginable during workout.

----------


## charger69

> You should love a good dose with a bunch of caffeine preworkout.
> Trick is to drink a monster or redbull, wait 30 minutes and dose your Epedrine. Then drink another redbull or monster gradually. 
> 
> The energy drinks contain a high inorganic acid content. This will raise your urine Ph levels and extend the half life of the drug by up to double. 
> You will get full kick all day. 
> 
> If you time it right when you go to piss after the second drink, your hair will stand on end and tingle. 
> 
> Even though it is a vasoconstrictor you will get the most God awful pump from it imaginable during workout.


Just remember Obs advice is advice from the devil. LOL


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

----------


## SocioMachiavelli

> 192.4 this morning.
> I need to ease it up the next couple days, I need to be a functioning human being for family stuff.
> I expect to add about 6-7 lbs (mostly water weight) during that time. By next Sunday that should be gone and I hope to have cracked 190. 
> I am currently leaner than I have been ... In over a decade. I find it very hard for me to lose fat, where putting on muscle is easy (for me).
> 
> Sent from my LG-LS993 using Tapatalk


Keep at it brother!

----------


## Obs

> Just remember Obs advice is advice from the devil. LOL
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


This is because of my DNA. 
I grew up in the 417 area code. 
Everyone born there instinctively has the ability to concentrate eped into meth within 15 minutes of being born.

----------


## charger69

> This is because of my DNA. 
> I grew up in the 417 area code. 
> Everyone born there instinctively has the ability to concentrate eped into meth within 15 minutes of being born.


LMAO!!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

----------


## HoldMyBeer

> You should love a good dose with a bunch of caffeine preworkout.
> Trick is to drink a monster or redbull, wait 30 minutes and dose your Epedrine. Then drink another redbull or monster gradually. 
> 
> The energy drinks contain a high inorganic acid content. This will raise your urine Ph levels and extend the half life of the drug by up to double. 
> You will get full kick all day. 
> 
> If you time it right when you go to piss after the second drink, your hair will stand on end and tingle. 
> 
> Even though it is a vasoconstrictor you will get the most God awful pump from it imaginable during workout.


See I've been doing it wrong! I've been doing the ECA when I wake up, then a half hour later pre-jym. Shoulda consulted the guru first!

Sent from my LG-LS993 using Tapatalk

----------


## HoldMyBeer

Time to see what madness is goin on at the local gym.

Sent from my LG-LS993 using Tapatalk

----------


## HoldMyBeer

So Sunday, 192.4
Then I ate whatever TF I wanted Monday and Tuesday.
This morning: 208.4 
Got a little bit of work ahead of me....

Sent from my LG-LS993 using Tapatalk

----------


## SocioMachiavelli

> So Sunday, 192.4
> Then I ate whatever TF I wanted Monday and Tuesday.
> This morning: 208.4 
> Got a little bit of work ahead of me....
> 
> Sent from my LG-LS993 using Tapatalk


The fuck did you eat lol?

----------


## HoldMyBeer

> The fuck did you eat lol?


Absolutely everything in site. It wasn't even enjoyable because I was so full I was nauseous for 2 days straight. I got a food problem.... it has to be 80% water weight. I'm not TOO worried. We will see over the next few days. Kinda pissed though, I was just starting to be able to see my ribs and upper abs before this

Sent from my LG-LS993 using Tapatalk

----------


## charger69

> Absolutely everything in site. It wasn't even enjoyable because I was so full I was nauseous for 2 days straight. I got a food problem.... it has to be 80% water weight. I'm not TOO worried. We will see over the next few days. Kinda pissed though, I was just starting to be able to see my ribs and upper abs before this
> 
> Sent from my LG-LS993 using Tapatalk


The secret is to splurge in moderation. 
I know you know this, but if you look at it as a diet, you will fail. 
It needs to be a lifestyle change for you to stay lean and sexy....: well, not sexy for me, just the girls .... and Obs. LOL


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

----------


## HoldMyBeer

The gyms a fucking madhouse. These casuals need to get out of my way before I start throwing elbows
I respect wanting to better yourself and go to the gym. But these people are only here because they feel guilty about how much food they ate, and I won't see them again until new years

Sent from my LG-LS993 using Tapatalk

----------


## charger69

> The gyms a fucking madhouse. These casuals need to get out of my way before I start throwing elbows
> I respect wanting to better yourself and go to the gym. But these people are only here because they feel guilty about how much food they ate, and I won't see them again until new years
> 
> Sent from my LG-LS993 using Tapatalk


You just put this pissed off look on your face and put your earphones in. They will get out of your way!!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

----------


## HoldMyBeer

> You just put this pissed off look on your face and put your earphones in. They will get out of your way!!
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Worked perfectly!

Sent from my LG-LS993 using Tapatalk

----------


## HoldMyBeer

208 -> 195.2 
That's a lot of water weight gone in only a couple days. I'll be back at 192 in a couple more.
The gym died down very quickly, I'll see those assholes again Jan. 2
Time to see what some tren /sdrol base can do and crush some legs

Sent from my LG-LS993 using Tapatalk

----------


## HoldMyBeer

192.2
I am getting very run down. Getting to the gym and through my workout is an absolute chore. Adding more stims doesn't help, just gives me a headache. I added a PWO inject hoping it would help salvage some level of intensity, but I don't notice anything.
I'm going to try a modest refeed tomorrow and lay off the stims, hopefully get a good night's sleep for once.

Sent from my LG-LS993 using Tapatalk

----------


## Obs

> 192.2
> I am getting very run down. Getting to the gym and through my workout is an absolute chore. Adding more stims doesn't help, just gives me a headache. I added a PWO inject hoping it would help salvage some level of intensity, but I don't notice anything.
> I'm going to try a modest refeed tomorrow and lay off the stims, hopefully get a good night's sleep for once.
> 
> Sent from my LG-LS993 using Tapatalk


Time the eca for the gym only.

----------


## HoldMyBeer

> Time the eca for the gym only.


My last dose is 2-3 pm, I need it for appetite suppression tho 

Sent from my LG-LS993 using Tapatalk

----------


## HoldMyBeer

I wrote a whole thing.... But fuck it.
I'll be available, but just not posting for a while. It doesn't look like I am going to hit my goal, and that is not sitting well with me. I need to reassess shit.
Later!

Sent from my LG-LS993 using Tapatalk

----------


## Old Duffer

You been pushin Damn hard. No dishonor in a regroup.

----------


## BG

Take a little break and let your cns recover, your not doing any good by pushing through. 


> 192.2
> I am getting very run down. Getting to the gym and through my workout is an absolute chore. Adding more stims doesn't help, just gives me a headache. I added a PWO inject hoping it would help salvage some level of intensity, but I don't notice anything.
> I'm going to try a modest refeed tomorrow and lay off the stims, hopefully get a good night's sleep for once.
> 
> Sent from my LG-LS993 using Tapatalk

----------


## charger69

> Take a little break and let your cns recover, your not doing any good by pushing through.


Easier said than done!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

----------


## Obs

> Easier said than done!
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Dont listen to him hit it hard!

----------


## Obs

> I wrote a whole thing.... But fuck it.
> I'll be available, but just not posting for a while. It doesn't look like I am going to hit my goal, and that is not sitting well with me. I need to reassess shit.
> Later!
> 
> Sent from my LG-LS993 using Tapatalk


Dont take no shit. Extend your goal a few weeks and starve yourself while preserving muscle with AAS and a bare minimal protein diet.

----------


## Obs

> You been pushin Damn hard. No dishonor in a regroup.





> Take a little break and let your cns recover, your not doing any good by pushing through.


Do you kiss your mothers with those foul mouths?

----------


## charger69

> Do you kiss your mothers with those foul mouths?


LMAO


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

----------


## HoldMyBeer

I forgot to mention that I've been eating until I feel sick every day for the past week (even when I wasn't hungry) and I'm up to 204. Which feels bad to say the least. I can't extend what Im doing because my body's barely holding up as it is. I'm just trying to get back to 191 before my body completely gives out.
Thanks for the support but this whole things has completely destroyed my self confidence. You can't have a problem w food like that and be a bodybuilder. So I'm just going to try to salvage some resemblance of self respect, go MIA for a while, and see how things work out

Sent from my LG-LS993 using Tapatalk

----------


## kelkel

Take a couple weeks off and regroup.

----------


## Obs

Smh....

----------


## Proximal

> I forgot to mention that I've been eating until I feel sick every day for the past week (even when I wasn't hungry) and I'm up to 204. Which feels bad to say the least. I can't extend what Im doing because my body's barely holding up as it is. I'm just trying to get back to 191 before my body completely gives out.
> Thanks for the support but this whole things has completely destroyed my self confidence. You can't have a problem w food like that and be a bodybuilder. So I'm just going to try to salvage some resemblance of self respect, go MIA for a while, and see how things work out
> 
> Sent from my LG-LS993 using Tapatalk


Come on HMB. Take a breath, refocus & grind at it again. Now its familiar territory. 

Hey I started off my last journey because of guys like you here. Come on bro, slow and steady - one pound at a time man.

----------


## Obs

> I forgot to mention that I've been eating until I feel sick every day for the past week (even when I wasn't hungry) and I'm up to 204. Which feels bad to say the least. I can't extend what Im doing because my body's barely holding up as it is. I'm just trying to get back to 191 before my body completely gives out.
> Thanks for the support but this whole things has completely destroyed my self confidence. You can't have a problem w food like that and be a bodybuilder. So I'm just going to try to salvage some resemblance of self respect, go MIA for a while, and see how things work out
> 
> Sent from my LG-LS993 using Tapatalk


I missed this...

You are going through a battle. 
Overcome it and you will be hardened. 
Keep on keeping on

----------


## SocioMachiavelli

I see you've been online

ready to try again motherfucker?

----------


## HoldMyBeer

Alright Im back. Ive been lurking a bit, just not posting.
I got down to 184 with a week left to my goal date (so a better person could have easily hit it). I had a ton of loose skin from being 50% body fat for so long. Everything I've read says Im going to need surgery to fix it. Got in a terrible head space from pushing it so hard for so long, and lost most of the progress I made. I just ran it way too hard for too long. 
I got my shit right now so I should be more active than I was.

----------


## Obs

> Alright Im back. Ive been lurking a bit, just not posting.
> I got down to 184 with a week left to my goal date (so a better person could have easily hit it). I had a ton of loose skin from being 50% body fat for so long. Everything I've read says Im going to need surgery to fix it. Got in a terrible head space from pushing it so hard for so long, and lost most of the progress I made. I just ran it way too hard for too long. 
> I got my shit right now so I should be more active than I was.


Glad you are back brother

----------


## spywizard

> Alright Im back. Ive been lurking a bit, just not posting.
> I got down to 184 with a week left to my goal date (so a better person could have easily hit it). I had a ton of loose skin from being 50% body fat for so long. Everything I've read says Im going to need surgery to fix it. Got in a terrible head space from pushing it so hard for so long, and lost most of the progress I made. I just ran it way too hard for too long. 
> I got my shit right now so I should be more active than I was.


so i read the 1st post ( some of it)... now this one.. congrats on what you have accomplished, setting new goals all the time is what makes us different.. don't be satisfied, you've done great keep going

----------


## Proximal

> Alright Im back. Ive been lurking a bit, just not posting.
> I got down to 184 with a week left to my goal date (so a better person could have easily hit it). I had a ton of loose skin from being 50% body fat for so long. Everything I've read says Im going to need surgery to fix it. Got in a terrible head space from pushing it so hard for so long, and lost most of the progress I made. I just ran it way too hard for too long. 
> I got my shit right now so I should be more active than I was.


Very glad you’re back. Damn, 184, way to go man!

----------


## HoldMyBeer

There is a lack of information out there on DNP , I found a good resource for information (although not perfect) when I was going through this BS back when and wanted to share it
I tried to edit out names and stuff, but I am lazy so I may have missed some


Q: How strong is crystal vs powder? A: clearly you didn't read the guide titled "THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN POWDER AND CRYSTAL" but ok. Chemically, crystal is 89% powder. So you have 1g of crystal? That's equivalent to 0.89g of powder. 
Q: How does 250mg/day affect you? How will it affect me? What's a recommended starting dose? A: There's a dosage guide, but whatever. Please try to give us your dose in mg/kg/day as a total dose means nothing without your weight. We recommend starting low, around 4mg/kg/day or less and don't increase your dose for the first two weeks 
Q: I'm taking 9mg/kg/day and I'm not feeling the heat, when should I increase my dose? A: Well how long have you been on it? You may not feel anything for the first few days since your total body concentration has to accumulate and stabilize - it's in the dosage guide. Another thing to consider is you might not feel heat if you don't eat carbs or if you have the windows open and the temperature is like 40°F and you're wearing a t shirt and shorts. And last thing is just because you don't feel the sides doesn't mean it's not working
________________________________________
Q: I have 250mg caps but I want to take 400mg/day, is there anything I can do? A: There's an easy formula for you! (Dose you have/Dosage you want) * 24 = how many hours between doses. Eg. (250/400) * 24 = 15hrs. So you should take your 250mg caps every 15 hours. easy as pie. 
Q: What's the advantage of split dosing over taking everything all at once? A: Ok, maybe you tried reading the dosage guide and didn't get to the end.. that's ok. No worries. In addition to being able to achieve stuff like the previous question, you also have smaller relative peaks in your total concentration. 
Q: How much will I lose taking x mg/day doing this, this, and this? A: Hello, can I point you to the cycle calculator in the announcements channel?
________________________________________
Q: What body fat percent do you think I'm at? :inserts picture: A: LMGTFY Alternatively, there are many at home body fat measuring systems. The caliper method may be the best one
LMGTFY

________________________________________
Q: Can I fast while taking DNP? A: I mean.... you can... but like... why... Here's the thing. When you fast, you rely on your excess energy stores for fuel right? If you fast too long, you end up running out and that's when you die or end up in a hospital. On DNP, you'll run through your energy stores a lot faster. You'll also probably feel much hungrier than if you weren't on DNP. Also have a look at the next question as well. Five day fasts are very much not recommended. Intermittent fasting is fine. 
Q: How much muscle vs fat will I lose on cycle? How can I keep my gainzzz? A: That depends on your diet. CICO rules weight loss, macros rule fat loss. If you prioritize consuming proteins, your body will tend to catabolize less of your muscles. This is true with or without DNP. A nice macro split on DNP would be 70/15/15 p/f/c (or 80/20/0 if you can manage it), to maintain muscle and increase the ratio of fat lost to total weight lost 
Q: Are carbs needed for DNP to work? A: I refer you to the "HOW DNP WORKS" paper. DNP does what it does whether you eat carbs or not. If you don't care to read the paper, I can tell you right now that carbs will make you hot. Eating carbs also means your body has to burn through that shit before it'll continue burning through your body's fat stores. You do yourself no favors by eating carbs on DNP really. Especially if your goal is fat loss (see above)
________________________________________
Q: How much time should I take off between cycles? A: Minimum, we recommend 2 weeks. It takes about 7 days for DNP to be out of your system, depending what dose you were taking, and you'll want another week off to reestablish mitochondrial uncoupling proteins. Another suggestion thrown around is time on = time off. 
Q: Do you build a tolerance to DNP? A: Short answer, yes. Long answer, umm I guess you can call it tolerance... Here's how it works. In your mitochondria, there are proteins called uncoupling protein (UCP). They work exactly the same way DNP does. They're produced naturally by your body, and they are necessary for the normal functioning of your cells. When you take DNP, the DNP molecules start taking over the job of the UCPs. Your cells notice that your UCPs seem to be better at their job, so it'll try to reduce how many there are. This will give you the effect of seeming like you're taking a slightly lower dose even if your dose hasn't changed in reality. NOW while this tolerance effect is noticeable, it does not get to a point where the same dose of DNP becomes ineffective.
________________________________________
Q: What supplements should I take? A: Water + electrolytes. Your major electrolytes are sodium, potassium, magnesium, calcium, and chloride. A multivitamin (scorpion has always recommended AnimalPak. someone else recommends PURE ONE. most multis you find in the store are generally not going to have enough of everything though, so find a high quality multi). Q: I thought I shouldn't supplement with potassium? Isn't too much potassium bad? A: I mean, by definition, too much of anything is bad yes. But let's think how likely you are to get too much potassium if you just take your electrolyte replacement drink like a normal person. Um.. not very likely. You lose potassium as you produce the stomach acid necessary to convert crystal to powder. You lose potassium as you sweat. You sweat a lot on DNP and lose a lot of potassium. Stop being so goddamn scared of potassium 
Q: Shouldn't I take x, y, and z to prevent PN/cataracts/just because someone said to? A: ok, so taking them won't hurt (unless you're overdosing, in which case you'll make your kidneys sad or get an upset stomach), but there's no evidence that taking anything will help with DNP induced PN or cataracts. Don't throw that article about Vit E&C for cataracts at me, those cataracts aren't caused by DNP are they? No? Then it's not applicable. As far as we can tell, your risk of PN/cataracts is very very low, and is increased by factors such as genetics (no your family history of cataracts doesn't mean you'll get DNP cataracts), taking stupid high doses, running cycles that are stupid long, running multiple cycles that are stupid long, etc. 
Q: I get tingles in my pinky toe, is ths PN?? A: h y p o x i a. If you had PN, you'd be in pain and/or you'd have numb fingers and toes. You'd know if you have PN
________________________________________
Q: I found DNP on ebay/alibaba/who the fuck knows where else (: should I buy it? A: If you're planning on ingesting that, then why the fuck are you looking there rather than at the safe sources we have. idc these are supposed to be short answers, here is a long list of reasons not to do it. 
1. Heavy metal contamination. If you're buying bulk powders, you don't know whether or not there's heavy metals in there unless you get it tested. Even then, you don't have a reliable way of removing those impurities
2. Other dinitrophenol contamination. Other isomers of 2,4-dinitrophenol exist. Some of them might be less effective than 2,4-DNP but that's fine and safe right. But some of them are way fuckin more potent than 2,4-DNP and are lethal at lower dosage ranges.
3. Other nitroaromatic contamination. In addition to dinitrophenols, there's dinitro-o-cresol, o-nitrophenol, p-nitrophenol, and more! Some of these are, again, more potent than 2,4-DNP and lethal at lower dosage ranges. Some of these inhibit the metabolism of DNP, increasing the half life and accumulation, meaning it'll be easier to accidentally reach overdose.
4. Measuring and capping. If what you're buying isn't measured and capped (or pressed), you're gonna have to deal with measuring out an accurate dose for yourself. I hope you have an accurate and precise kitchen scale. And a shitton of patience. And oh god if someone else asks why sources put fillers in caps, I might just hurt someone.
So while we obviously don't condone this, if for some reason you still decide to do the thing, get your product tested by a lab, and make sure there aren't any harmful impurities
________________________________________
Q: I heard T4 to T3 conversion is inhibited by DNP should I take T3? A: First, DNP does not inhibit T4 to T3 conversion. That would be due to just losing weight, since y'know that happens when you lose weight. Once you stop losing weight and maintain for a bit, these hormones will restabilise. Second, even if it was inhibited by DNP (and, again, it's not), supplementing with T3 will inhibit T4 to T3 conversion even more. Really? Yes. Your body has a nice negative feedback loop whereby the presence of T3 decreases the formation of more T3. Q: Should I take creatine on cycle? Will it help me lose more weight? A: Creatine will not help you lose more weight. It might help you feel more energetic or less like you're dying, but that's about it. You can take it if you want it, but it will not help you burn more energy. Nor does it somehow magically synergize with DNP and make it more effective or whatever. Just think of creatine like a back up battery for your car that you can only charge using your main battery. (in this great analogy, you happen to have a completely electric car)
________________________________________
Q: I'm not losing weight on DNP; what's up with that? A: One of two things is happening. Either you're retaining water, and you'll drop most of the weight as soon as you're off DNP - assuming you're only on for a week or two. This only applies if you're on for a couple weeks; the water retention can only hide your weightloss for so long. OR you're out eating DNP. Oh yes, you can out eat it. What's that? You're only having chicken and rice every night and you're sure it's only 300cals and you're totally not retaining water? Then you're eating way more than you say you are. 
Q: ya but I'm doing the same thing I did last time and last time I lost a pound a day? A: yeah well your hormones would like a word with you. You might be doing everything exactly the same, but your body is not exactly the same. 
Q: So what should I eat on cycle? A: I don't know how you got this far in the faqs without seeing my recommendation for a 70p/15f/15c (or 80/20/0) macro split, but there it is again. Eat at 75% caloric maintenance and you should be all good. Other diet plans that work well for other people, and aren't totally dumb, are keto and PSMF. Guess what they all have in common? (very low carbs)
________________________________________
Q: I'm a girl, what do I have to do differently? A: nothing, just read the rest of the faqs. it's written to be applicable to both sexes
________________________________________
Q: How much will DNP increase my metabolism? Something like 100mg is an 11% increase? A: So we've looked through some old and new studies, and it looks like a better estimate may be that for every 1mg/kg/day of powder, you get a 12-15% increase in metabolism, after having reached full accumulation. This equates to about 10.68-13.35% increase for every 1mg/kg/day of crystal after reaching full accumulation.
________________________________________
Q: Why am I not losing weight? I'm running a cycle of DNP+tren +.... A: There's a 90% chance it's the tren and water weight. You'll probably drop it after you stop DNP. At the very least you probably had some insane body recomp going on. There is a tiny chance it's not water weight and you're outeating the DNP. You'll have to analyze your diet to be sure
________________________________________
Q: When is the best time to take DNP? Morning? Night? A: That varies by individual. Some people find they get way to tired during the day if they dose in the morning. Some people find they can't sleep at night and are too uncomfortable or hot if they dose before bed. You'll have to figure out which category you fall under to decide what time to take your doses. Also see the dosage guide paper to learn how split dosing might help your comfort levels. 
Q: Why are my eyes/skin/pee/other bodily fluids yellow? A: Well DNP is used as a dye. It gets excreted in your bodily fluids including sweat, tears, saliva, urine, semen, and vaginal fluid. That means it will stain your skin, eyes and bedsheets; your sexy time fluids will be yellow; and your pee will be neon yellow even if you drink a gallon of water a day. The amount of staining is proportional to the dosage you are taking (low dose means almost unnoticeable staining)
________________________________________
Q: Will my DNP semen make mutant babies? Or will taking DNP make me unable to have babies? Will DNP fry the eggs in my ovaries? A: Yikes. No. Nothing is negatively impacted in any significant way. If the male is on DNP, it'll make it's way to the sperm and affect their motility by impairing their energy source. Imagine trying to swim in the Olympics while taking a high dose of DNP. If the female is on DNP, her eggs will develop normally, though it may take longer (due to not getting enough nutrition. In the same way some women stop menstruating if they're malnourished). DNP does not "fry" the eggs - do you think getting a fever fries the eggs? Your body temp can be raised higher when you get a fever than when you take DNP. If she gets pregnant, the baby will develop as long as she gets enough nourishment to feed both herself and her baby. There is a higher chance of losing the baby because of inadequate nutrition, again - much the same way an anorexic woman, not eating enough, has a higher chance of losing their baby. All of the same goes for the chances of birth defects.

----------

