# COMPETITIVE BODYBUILDING - POWERLIFTING - ATHLETICS & SPORTS > POWERLIFTING FORUM >  Squat 345 - form check help

## Brett N

Hey guys, was just hoping someone could help me out and check the form on my squat. I have been doing stronglifts 5x5 and when I started getting pretty heavy I switched to a 3x5. I feel like my legs can handle heavier than 345 (this lift) but when I get done my lower back is pretty sore. This is directly after I finish and it seems to affect6 my next lift. I also have some pains in my left knee which may or may not be caused by the lift. 

I am 42 years old, been lifting steady around 2 years. Any input, advice or anything that may help me progress please let me know. I am not looking to become the next big guy. I may even be looking at going to more of a bodybuilding type lifting instead of powerlifting because to be honest my vanity is more important at this stage in life than actually being super strong. Both would be ideal.

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## Brett N

Holy crap, just noticed my hairline looks like it's receding a little.  :LOL:

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## Chevroletstud

I'm certainly no expert, in fact I don't even squat very often. But I notice you need to keep your back erect. At the top of your lift you bend your back to stand straight up. Adding a slight good morning type lift at end. Keep those abs tight going down. No wonder your lower back gets sore.

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## zempey

I know they say to go deep when doing squats, but if it causes low back pain and knee pain, then maybe you don't have the genetic structure to go deep. I am tall and can't go that deep with any more than 2 plates a side. It does look like you lean forward to get lower and keep balance which will cause both pains you have. Once you go past parallel you chance damaging your knees. Do you wear a belt or knee wraps? I use a belt due to a back injury and knee wraps after 3 plates. Going that deep with 345 is impressive, try stopping at parallel and see if your pains go away, use the leg press to go deep.

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## Brett N

On my phone so sorry for typos. 

I used to go a lot deeper than what I was doing here. I actually thought it looked like I was fairly close to parallel when I go down. I will try to stop a little higher than where I am gong now. I don't have any machines in garage though. Just free weights, bench and cage. 

I agree that I probably Ned a little core work to help the overall squat. I thought about doing a 20% de load and trying to increase reps to build up core that way. I guess I could also supplement good mornings too. 

Really never used a belt when lifting. I always felt like it would just be a crutch that would take away from the core strengthening. Never used a knee wrap either. What do they actually do? Just help support when using it?

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## zempey

I found the knee wraps gave me more stability to put the power to the ground, my knees would wobble at 4 plates so I got some wraps and it helped a lot. Being tall I am at a disadvantage on a lot of lifts so I use things like this for safety. You could try and close up your stance a bit, that might take a bit of pressure off your knees. I am not in the school of thought to not use wraps and straps, I use straps for shrugs because I couldn't expect my grip muscles to hold 500lbs for reps, and I wouldn't sacrifice my traps growth over limited grip. Try doing planks for your core before your workouts, I do a quick treadmill warmup then some stretching and some planks to get my body ready to work.

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## Brett N

I will do that. Thanks for the input on this. I will lay around with my stance to see if it feels better on my knee. I will look into a wrap too.

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## Lifted1

Depth is fine, but watch the upper body folding forward "good morning" style...that will certainly cause the lower back strain you're experiencing. Just drop some weight, "reset" from everything you've been doing and concentrate on your form more than weight. Also try picking a spot on the wall at eye level when you're standing straight up and keep locked on it while squating...it will help you stay straight. Good luck brotha!

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## Iceberg

To me it looks like your knees are going in. I try to keep mine over my feet.

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## Brett N

The only thing I have when i squat more upright, it seems like my knees track pretty far forward to keep balance. This was something that Rippetoe always talked about being aware of so I thought that was a bad thing. 

As for the knees coming in. I agree that when my weight gets on the heavier side my instinct is to let my knees come in a bit when standing. This is something I have always dealt with. Definitely need to work on it. 

The head moving upward is another thing I'm aware of. I do have a spot about 8 foot in front of me that I focus on. I will try to get a fixed spot on the wall and put more effort into it instead of looking up in the direction that I want to go. 

I think what I'm going to do is drop weight maybe down to 225 and really focus on form. Keeping knees out and more upright. 

These flaws in form never seem to be there until I go heavy. Then it seems like every flaw gets exaggerated. 

I appreciate all the advice.

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## zempey

Form always gets harder to maintain when the weight gets heavier.

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## marcus300

You need to look up and focus on a spot high up because your balance is off and your back is taking a lot of strain. You also need to tense your core pre lift and keep your knees stable. Again looks to me like a balance issue and core but wont take much to correct these.

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## BG

You need to "low bar". Squat with the bar lower on your traps, will help keep the weights from pulling you forward and look up as Big Marcus said.

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## Brett N

I think I'm going to do what I was saying earlier and drop the weight some and really work on my form. I will pos another video in a few weeks and try to get a little more input on what else I need to correct. 

Lots of advice here , knew this would be the best place to ask.

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## zempey

I put the bar between my traps and rear delts, that's as low as I can get.

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## Brett N

Dropped to 225 today. Eyes focused on a spot on the wall at eye height standing. Flexed my core when squatting and tried to keep my torso as upright as possible without letting my knees go too far in front of my toes. As far as the bar position, it's as low as it can go while still being able to hold it without fear of it rolling off. Same as I always had it. Next time I will post a back view with my shirt off to show. When I dropped and lifted, I did it with deliberate purpose and didn't question my knee position. I believe this kept my knees more locked out and not like a hesitant wiggle or kneeing in. 

All that being said, 225 seemed a little harder than it should of been. Maybe it was because I was trying so hard to change things that I didn't just squat down and lift it. Gonna keep at this weight for 3-5 more times until I feel like it is more of a fluid motion with good form and then add 5 lbs everytime.

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## F4iGuy

If you're squatting high bar try pointing your elbows down toward the floor. Poke your chest up, squeeze the heck out of the bar, and point your elbows down. That should straighten your back.

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## motivated247

My back gets sore when I do Good Mornings as well, how much do you back squat? But seriously to stop the hips rising which is causing you to good morning you need to lift from top up, think of a marinet puppet, up and down.
up you lift your head, push with your torso, then push legs and squeeze glutes.

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## Brett N

I get that but it is easier said than done when you are reaching the upper limits of what you can lift. 

I'm working on it now but it seems that correcting my form is a little harder than what I had planned. Habits are difficult to break. Just a process, pain in the ass but it needs to be done. 

I have never done a one rep max so not sure how much I can squat, really doesn't matter though. This was my form going to shit at 345. If I can't do 345 with good form then I really don't see a reason to go heavier and cause even more pain with bad form. I am at 225 and holding steady until I feel my form change has become second nature again.

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## Khazima

The squat is one of the simplest, yet most technical moves there is. Due to the massive range of motion there is Sooo much to it. Think of one thing to fix per session, don't focus on to many things at once. Try to drill that one thing in each session.

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## kelkel

Wear a pair of shoes with a slight heel. Maybe work boots or something. See what kind of difference it makes for you. You need a slight heel when squatting, deadlifting no. This in itself will help remove your slight hitch and make you mechanically more efficient. Other than that I didn't see anything as I was to focused on the receding hairline.....

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## Mp859

> I didn't see anything as I was to focused on the receding hairline.....


 You kill me bro. Haha

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## kelkel

> You kill me bro. Haha


Appearing daily.....

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## southernboy31

These guys pretty much hit everything. 

1) start of light with a few warm up sets. Stretch in between each of your warm up sets. You have to prepare your body to lift heavy. 

2) wear a belt as tight as you can get it. This allows you too keep your core tight and push against the belt

3) keep back strait and don't over flex at your hips. Picking a spot on the ceiling and looking up will help achieve this. 

4) self evaluate. Your def looking good on the depth but if your hurting your prob trying to go to heavy to soon

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## RewardingLabor

I think you should look at the pattern of movement in the second video. No one has defined exactly what you do yet but one of your legs definitely pushes harder than the other, almost like you are doing a single leg squat at a key moment. 

Your left leg is really stable, if you could find a way to lift with your right leg too at the bottom of the rep while keeping your back up i bet you add a couple plates.

Edit: I don't know exactly how to correct that hip sway but maybe someone else does.

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## zempey

I found the knee wraps helped balance out my week side and allow me to confidently push without my week side knee turning in.

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## RewardingLabor

> I found the knee wraps helped balance out my week side and allow me to confidently push without my week side knee turning in.


Is there a way to correct the problem without external gear?

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## zempey

Build up the muscle strength slowly, I guess. I have long legs so I just use the wraps as insurance so my knee's are kept stable.

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## Brett N

Going a lot smoother now. Still have weight at 225. The one leg being weaker was most likely my knee pain I have been having. Seems to be feeling better. Lots of advice, some conflicting. 

I hate lifting with shoes. Guess I may need to look into it. I don't think that wearing a really tight lifting belt is the answer. Seems like a band aid for a weaker core. I have been doing more core work. May take a bit to see if it helps. But, I plan on very slowly increasing weight. Like, maybe 5 pounds every 2 weeks. This should give my legs and core enought time to get stronger.

Edit - by the way, I really am not going bald. My wife is just a really bad barber. Have no idea how she manages to color halfy hairs gray either.

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## bifda

> If you're squatting high bar try pointing your elbows down toward the floor. Poke your chest up, squeeze the heck out of the bar, and point your elbows down. That should straighten your back.


This ^ 
Chest out, grip tight and maybe feet I lil wider.

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## Brett N

I am not squatting high bar.

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## pleaselaborate

If you can try and get you a yoke bar to squat with. The yoke bar has helped my posture extremely in the squat. It has enabled me to keep an upright posture throughout the whole lift.

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## Cutthroat10

When I watch the side view your bar path is off, you're getting out on your toes. As others have said, open your eyes, look a little higher almost as if you're trying to pinch the bar with your traps, chest out and it'll help with the back arching issue and elbows down. I've read and listened to a lot of people talk about the squat and not all agree on everything so I looked at the best squatters ever, Kirk Karwoski, Ed Coan, Dan Green, Dave Tate, etc. These guys are some of the best in the sport so I watch their videos and read their articles. Hope that helps.

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## Khazima

> When I watch the side view your bar path is off, you're getting out on your toes. As others have said, open your eyes, look a little higher almost as if you're trying to pinch the bar with your traps, chest out and it'll help with the back arching issue and elbows down. I've read and listened to a lot of people talk about the squat and not all agree on everything so I looked at the best squatters ever, Kirk Karwoski, Ed Coan, Dan Green, Dave Tate, etc. These guys are some of the best in the sport so I watch their videos and read their articles. Hope that helps.


Check out Chris Duffin as well, he has a 4x bodyweight squat world record @ 220 raw and has a whole video series on the squat.

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## Marc114

Lots of good advice given. My two cents , get your breathing right. Big air on top , fill the belly up , get tight and push against the abs (this is where a belt comes in handy). Exhale on the way up. I know if my breathing isn't right things start to fall apart. Keep up the good work!

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## southernboy31

Wearing a belt is up to you. I personally don't do any heavy squats without one as I like to push with my abs and also protect my back. YouTube Richard "the ant" Hawthorne. He's arguably pound for pound one of the strongest guys in the world and currently holds like 13 world titles. He's weighs in around 135-142 and hits over a 660 dead lift raw. He has several videos on squats and bench press. He also wears a belt by the way

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## JohnnyJim

> Holy crap, just noticed my hairline looks like it's receding a little.


Knees were buckling inwards. Definitely have to fix that.  :Smilie:

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## Motardpdx

Hi, I agree that your knee is inward and shaky. Perhaps, one leg is pushing harder then the other or less weight and focus on form. http://youtu.be/Dy28eq2PjcM Cheers!

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## The Deadlifting Dog

You're also coming down with one shoulder lower than the other.
Check out the front view.

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## jackfrost88

Good weight for training 2 years! Not sure if it's the angle of the camera but your definitely favouring your right leg, isn't symmetric. What I was instructed to do (I naturally do the same thing), is focus during your lift on pushing off the sides of your feet almost "screwing them out" to activate the hips more and lift the weight evenly. Also once your leaving the hole don't be afraid to look up. Good work!

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## Baxter35

Kelkel mentioned wearing boots with a heel. I also lift at home and therefore don't wear shoes, and I've also been having problems with lower back pain recently after squatting heavy. I tried squatting today with an old pair of work boots on and I have to say it made a world of difference. It felt a little weird, but it definitely helped my posture on the bottom. I went up as high as 405 for a few sets and I literally have zero back pain from it. I also felt like the boots kept my feet more "planted" so it was easier to keep my knees stable, which helped as well. If you haven't yet, try boots. I'm a believer now.

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## Buster Brown

> Kelkel mentioned wearing boots with a heel. I also lift at home and therefore don't wear shoes, and I've also been having problems with lower back pain recently after squatting heavy. I tried squatting today with an old pair of work boots on and I have to say it made a world of difference. It felt a little weird, but it definitely helped my posture on the bottom. I went up as high as 405 for a few sets and I literally have zero back pain from it. I also felt like the boots kept my feet more "planted" so it was easier to keep my knees stable, which helped as well. If you haven't yet, try boots. I'm a believer now.


Make sure whatever you wear that your soles are solid and not spongy. I do better deadlifting with wrestling shoes or barefoot and squatting with a heel.

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## Baxter35

Yep, they have a nice solid rubber sole. Agree on the barefoot deadlifts.

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## -Ender-

> Hey guys, was just hoping someone could help me out and check the form on my squat. I have been doing stronglifts 5x5 and when I started getting pretty heavy I switched to a 3x5. I feel like my legs can handle heavier than 345 (this lift) but when I get done my lower back is pretty sore. This is directly after I finish and it seems to affect6 my next lift. I also have some pains in my left knee which may or may not be caused by the lift. 
> 
> I am 42 years old, been lifting steady around 2 years. Any input, advice or anything that may help me progress please let me know. I am not looking to become the next big guy. I may even be looking at going to more of a bodybuilding type lifting instead of powerlifting because to be honest my vanity is more important at this stage in life than actually being super strong. Both would be ideal.


I agree with previous posts. Look up

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## pushit_05

> Yep, they have a nice solid rubber sole. Agree on the barefoot deadlifts.


Or you could deadlift in chucks as training then lift barefoot in comp. Nice way to always train at about an inch deficit.

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## KinMan

Looks like you're mixing 'low bar' and 'high bar' technique. From what I saw, I'd simply lower the bar between your traps and delts. Then, concentrate at bending at the hip first, knees come second. Also, keep your head up, not down. Keep your eyes locked on a target about 45 degrees up.

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