# STEROIDS FORUM > ANABOLIC STEROIDS - QUESTIONS & ANSWERS >  Sustanon 250 and winstrol first cycle

## 0311

Have been doing alot of reading for the past couple of weeks. Did some local research and found that sustanon 250 and winstrol are most readily available. Both injections. Looking to lean out and improve cardio. Did alot of cardio in the marines but knew nothing about strength training. Could barely do 5 pull ups. In the past two years I've gone from barely benching 135lbs to doing 300lbs 3-5 times and pull ups have increased to 18. Anyway, here's my stats.

25
6'
230lbs

Had a real solid diet until I went overseas for a job a couple months ago. Now I'm stuck with MRE style food. Canned fruit, canned/frozen veggies, bags of chicken, cans of tuna and oatmeal. Let me know what you guys think. Start to finish, PCT, the whole works.

Thanks

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## higgy

Drop the winny and keep the sustanon 
sust 250-2 times a week/10weeks

pct
clomid100/75/50/50
nolva40/40/20/20

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## 0311

How much for each dosage? Also, when do I start the pct and what does 100/75/50/50 refer to?

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## jla1986

On the sust i would run nothing less than 500 a week which would be 2 injections a week like stated earlier. Start the pct 2 to 3 week after last injection, take for 4 to 6 weeks.

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## layeazy

good base sus is enough for some decent gains

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## 0311

Main goal is to cut weight more then build muscle. Was going to do winny only but read that it can slow down your ability to make test. Should I still do test only or looking to stack it with something else like clen ?

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## 0311

Can also get a hold of test e. Should I start out with a low dosage, increase then decrease at the end?

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## cro

you in the corps? i was 0311


> Can also get a hold of test e. Should I start out with a low dosage, increase then decrease at the end?

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## 0311

And everything is refered to in milligrams unless otherwise noted, right?

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## 0311

Got out a couple years ago. Was with 2/4 out at Pendleton.

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## cro

i was in 2/4 also bro the magnifacent bastards. we were stationed at lejeune in the 90s

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## brolic272

> On the sust i would run nothing less than 500 a week which would be 2 injections a week like stated earlier. Start the pct 2 to 3 week after last injection, take for 4 to 6 weeks.


does it make much of a difference if you only pin twice a week on sust250 or is should it really be pinned eod? and why would you run nothing less than 500mg a week for a first cycle? i would assume a beginner would want less sides and start a bit lower?

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## 0311

So thinking about running it like this. 

wk 1-10 test 500mg
wk 7-12 winny 50mg ED
wk 1-16 nolva 10mg ED
wk 13-16 clomid

Any thoughts?

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## 0311

Got a hold of some of the gear today. Should be getting the winny next week. The test is made in Iran, which I'm a little opposed to, but whatever. Also, Nolvadex is legal here so shouldn't be any question about legitimacy. 

Going to be taking creatine, glutamine, whey, multivitamin and animal stacks along with this.

Let me know what you guys think.

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## ANIMAL

> So thinking about running it like this. 
> 
> wk 1-10 test 500mg
> wk 7-12 winny 50mg ED
> wk 1-16 nolva 10mg ED
> wk 13-16 clomid
> 
> Any thoughts?


Which test will determine amount and length and IMO you should be running the winny with the test at the end of your cycle for 6 weeks.

Read the sticky for the PCT: http://forums.steroid.com/showthread...dated-08-12-09

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## topshelf75

I've run Sustanon and Winny before and it works great for what you're looking for. Lean gains and you definitely gain strength. I usually do 1 shot of Sust every 4 days and try to do 50mg winny ED, but sometimes its EOD depending on how the pinning site feels....I've never noticed any difference in going with winny ED or EOD.

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## 0311

> Which test will determine amount and length and IMO you should be running the winny with the test at the end of your cycle for 6 weeks.


That does sound like a better idea. Plus, at about week 12 it will be June, and I want to be leveled back out before those 120-130* days roll in. Just to be safe. Does the PCT look good?

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## dosXX

for pct weeks, make sure to bump up your nolva to 40/40/20/20. That's 40mg for wk 13, 40mg wk 14, 20mg wk 15 . . . For clomid just do 50/50/50/50

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## 0311

Thanks for breaking that down for me.

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## 0311

Here's an average schedual and the plan for the upcoming weeks.

Leave for work at 4am. Get home at 730pm. Usually in the gym by 8 and try to be in bed by 930. Incorperating two rest days since sometimes I may not be home until about 10pm. Planning to do heavy weight and have minimal rest inbetween sets. Day off is dedicated to strictly cardio. 




Monday:
Run 10 minutes
Flat bench 4 sets
Incline bench 4 sets
Decline bench 4 sets
Superset flys/push ups 4 sets 10x

Tuesday:
Dumbell curls 4 sets
Curl machine 4 sets
Cable curls 4 sets
Tricep pull downs 4 sets
Seated dumbell tricep ext 4 sets
Skull crushers 4 sets
Superset decline situps/leg raises 4 sets 10x

Wednesday:
Run 3-5k
Bike 6-8k

Thursday: 
Dumbell military press 4 sets
Shoulder press machine 4 sets
Hitlers 4 sets
Burpees 3 sets 10x (really wanted to incorperate this workout. I know it's a pushup motion but I've always felt it alot in my shoulders, probably because of the divebomber style. Also, keeps the joints flexible)
Shrugs 4 set
Superset GHD situps/hanging leg raises 4 sets 10x

Friday: 
Run 5-10 minutes
Pull ups wide/normal/narrow 3 sets
Lat pull downs 4 sets
Seated narrow rows 4 sets
Bent over rows 4 sets
Superset KB swing/back ext. (Again, like that workout)

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## ANIMAL

Why aren't legs in your routine? I don't think if made a lay out of my lift routine in 3 years. I usually don't know what body part I'm working out until I step out of the locker room. I've always been a firm believer of, if you're not pumped to train a certain muscle group that day and you do, you're not going to have a good workout. 

But regardless, legs need to be in your routine. Squats are a huge part of your lift, as well as deadlifts, which I also don't see.

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## 0311

I'm usually the same way. I typically work chest and back alot. But, I made a schedule because of time constraints. I have never really lifted legs. Being from Colorado and having Pikes Peak in my backyard has always sufficed. Plus, I could always out lift my friends who use only machines. Now that I'm in the flat desert I'll include them here and there.

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## Chev

IMO sust should be pinned EOD, to do it right. Why half ass your cycle pinning E3D or 4? Add in legs man, your not in high school anymore. Train hard, eat right, and get good rest. You cant go wrong! good luck

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## BJJ

> So thinking about running it like this. 
> 
> wk 1-10 test 500mg
> wk 7-12 winny 50mg ED
> wk 1-16 nolva 10mg ED
> wk 13-16 clomid
> 
> Any thoughts?


I would drop the winny and use sust at that dosage but with 2 injections per week, not more.
Also, I would avoid taking tamoxifen citrate during your bulking, instead I would use mesterolone @ 100 mg ed throughout till PCT.
PCT with clomiphene citrate only could be enough but I would be sure and use also nolvadex @ 20 mg ed for 4 weeks.

Also, be aware if you could add HCG during your cycle, your recovery would be much easier.

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## BJJ

Another thing is blood work.
Do not underestimate its importance.
So, I would get it before cycle and 4/6 weeks ex end of PCT.

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## 0311

Ok. And forgot to mention, I was able to get ahold of test e, not sust 250. Also, should I only take the nolva during if I start feeling sides?

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## 0311

Also, how much on the HCG ?

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## Honkey_Kong

You shouldn't take nolva during. save it for PCT. If you're getting sides you should take an AI.

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## 0311

> If you're getting sides you should take an AI.


Which AI would you recommend?

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## 0311

I've updated my cycle after reading some more. 

wk 1-10 test e 500mg
wk 5-10 winny 50mg ED
wk 12-15 nolva 40/40/20/20
wk 12-15 clomind 50/50/50/50/

Letro on hand just in case gyno forms.

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## johnny698

18years old 200 20%bf
Week1-2 250mg/week sust for whole cycle
Week3-8 500mg/week
Week9-10 250mg/week
Wintabs week 6-7 3/mg/day
Week 7-9 48mg/day
Week 10 36mg/day wanna know If I wanna see good gains its my first cycle

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## upperhandy

start your own thread instead of hijacking a year old one : Hijack:

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