# STEROIDS FORUM > IGF-1 LR3, HGH, and INSULIN QUESTIONS >  Is 4IU HGH a day enough for growing muscle cells?

## realjo1000

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## Benches505

Higher dosages rendered useless? That is nonsense brother!

4IU/ed will help with fat and might build new muscle cells over time..5-6IU is a better starting point for that purpose

What is your age?

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## BG

Dont worry about it growing muscle cells, use it for the synergy it creates with AS and recovery purposes, right there its worth the $$$.

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## realjo1000

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## Superhuman

I ran it at 4IUs a day and I didn't feel shit... no phenomenal growth. I did it for about 4 months. I'd say at least 6-8/day

OH, btw it DID give me SEVERE joint pain to the point where I would have to cut some workouts short and stop benching. After I got off I had no more joint pain so I know it was the growth.

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## gixxerboy1

> Higher dosages rendered useless? That is nonsense brother!
> 
> 4IU/ed will help with fat and might build new muscle cells over time..5-6IU is a better starting point for that purpose
> 
> What is your age?


+1 cosign

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## realjo1000

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## Benches505

Yes, I had positive results with 4IU, I ran that for 4 months and then started to go higher. I've tried every protocol at this point. I like the 5-6IU/ed 7x week best. I'm growing! keeping gains off cycle and then growing some more.

It is not a waste of money at 4iu/ed

2IU ed is a waste to me unless you happen to be about 50 with different goals.


*** Note, I am not growing fast but what you gain with gh you KEEP!!!  :Wink:

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## realjo1000

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## RedBaron

In my experience, it really ***ends somewhat on the HGH. I wrote my guides while I was using Genotropin and Humatrope, and the suggestion of 5 IU's or so was based on using those American brands. In my experimentation with many of the import offerings, I have to run more along the lines of 9-10 IU's to get the same benefit I was getting with 5-6 of the American brands.

The other little wrinkle is that it is a somewhat personal response. Your age, overall health profile, your natural IGF levels, you genetic dispositions, and many other factors are going to determine how you respond to HGH therapy. Some people are very sensitive to the effects and seem to see results from the lower end of a reasonable dosage. Others (like me), have to run respectible doses to see much when building muscle is the goal.

Best advice is to conduct a little personal experimentation to see what dose is required for your desired goal. As soon as you have that established, you will be on the way.

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## dale

> In my experience, it really ***ends somewhat on the HGH. I wrote my guides while I was using Genotropin and Humatrope, and the suggestion of 5 IU's or so was based on using those American brands. In my experimentation with many of the import offerings, I have to run more along the lines of 9-10 IU's to get the same benefit I was getting with 5-6 of the American brands.
> 
> The other little wrinkle is that it is a somewhat personal response. Your age, overall health profile, your natural IGF levels, you genetic dispositions, and many other factors are going to determine how you respond to HGH therapy. Some people are very sensitive to the effects and seem to see results from the lower end of a reasonable dosage. Others (like me), have to run respectible doses to see much when building muscle is the goal.
> 
> Best advice is to conduct a little personal experimentation to see what dose is required for your desired goal. As soon as you have that established, you will be on the way.


hey RB...with GH, is there a point of diminishing returns as far as higher doseges and burning fat?

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## Benches505

That is a major point that I forgot about... GH brands vary big time! 4IU of humatrope is very different from 4IU of hyge.






> In my experience, it really ***ends somewhat on the HGH. I wrote my guides while I was using Genotropin and Humatrope, and the suggestion of 5 IU's or so was based on using those American brands. In my experimentation with many of the import offerings, I have to run more along the lines of 9-10 IU's to get the same benefit I was getting with 5-6 of the American brands.
> 
> The other little wrinkle is that it is a somewhat personal response. Your age, overall health profile, your natural IGF levels, you genetic dispositions, and many other factors are going to determine how you respond to HGH therapy. Some people are very sensitive to the effects and seem to see results from the lower end of a reasonable dosage. Others (like me), have to run respectible doses to see much when building muscle is the goal.
> 
> Best advice is to conduct a little personal experimentation to see what dose is required for your desired goal. As soon as you have that established, you will be on the way.

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## IBdmfkr

I've ran it a few times now and I believe under the age of 30 GH isn't worth the money or nearly compare to the hype that ppl put on it.

Save your money and spend it on something worthwhile IMO.

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## bbitner

do you see the same gains and benefits from rHGH as HGH?

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## dale

> do you see the same gains and benefits from rHGH as HGH?


it's the same thing...r=recombint (spelling?)

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## bbitner

rHGH (recombinant -artificially created) will have equal results as using HGH? Sense-of-well being, mental aquity, muscle growth, and increased energy. Or, is the rHGH more for muscle development only? The price is very different betweent the two products is the reason I am asking.
Thanks.

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## dale

> rHGH (recombinant -artificially created) will have equal results as using HGH? Sense-of-well being, mental aquity, muscle growth, and increased energy. Or, is the rHGH more for muscle development only? The price is very different betweent the two products is the reason I am asking.
> Thanks.


the only real 191 amino acid rHGH is injectable. i don't fully understand your question, i think you've been reading too many BS websites claiming to sell HGH that you ingest. if it is true 191aa GH then there is no difference between rHGH and HGH...they are not two different products.

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## RedBaron

> hey RB...with GH, is there a point of diminishing returns as far as higher doseges and burning fat?


In all of the experimentation that I have done with self and others I would say yes. I have ran doses from 0.5 IU's up to 16 IU's per day over the last 8 years. As the dose rises, there is a point that the rate of fat loss really doesn't occur much faster. The amount of HGH that will provide optimum rate of fat loss will probably vary somewhat from person to person, but it does indeed seem to level off.

That being said, when fat loss is the goal 3 IU's or so will get you at least acceptable results for most people ... experimenting with higher doses can accelerate the process somewhat. Of course, HGH is a REALLY expensive way to acheive fat loss. I would never run it for only that purpose.

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## realjo1000

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## Titan1

> In my experience, it really ***ends somewhat on the HGH. I wrote my guides while I was using Genotropin and Humatrope, and the suggestion of 5 IU's or so was based on using those American brands. In my experimentation with many of the import offerings, I have to run more along the lines of 9-10 IU's to get the same benefit I was getting with 5-6 of the American brands.
> 
> The other little wrinkle is that it is a somewhat personal response. Your age, overall health profile, your natural IGF levels, you genetic dispositions, and many other factors are going to determine how you respond to HGH therapy. Some people are very sensitive to the effects and seem to see results from the lower end of a reasonable dosage. Others (like me), have to run respectible doses to see much when building muscle is the goal.
> 
> Best advice is to conduct a little personal experimentation to see what dose is required for your desired goal. As soon as you have that established, you will be on the way.


I must ask how can it be such a big difference between HGH and HGH ? It sounds very strange its like 100mg of test cant be stronger then 100mg of test just because its another brand the only thing is if one brand is underdosed but lets say jintropin which is a brand, HGH it should be correctly dosed so i dont understand how it can be such a difference.
Im not saying you´re wrong but i just dont understand how because you have to admitt it sounds illogical.

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## MorganKane

> I must ask how can it be such a big difference between HGH and HGH ? It sounds very strange its like 100mg of test cant be stronger then 100mg of test just because its another brand the only thing is if one brand is underdosed but lets say jintropin which is a brand, HGH it should be correctly dosed so i dont understand how it can be such a difference.
> Im not saying you´re wrong but i just dont understand how because you have to admitt it sounds illogical.


its not "illogical" and its true.
It has something to do with the "purity" of the product, how its manufactured.

think about it this way.
10 ml of 100mg Test prop, the manufacture should have use 1 gram of test in that vial. But what would happen if they used 1 gram of test but the quality of the powder was only 90% pure?
you would end up with a weaker product.

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## SUSTBOY

I have used 4iu/day 6 days/week for over 3 years now. I have found that is the perfect amount for weight loss, and size/strength retention when I come off cycle.

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## znak

My experience is that you get new muscle growth at even 2 ius ed, *if you use it long enough.*
I agree with Red Baron that hgh is a horrendously expensive to lose weight/fat if that is your only goal.

HGH results ***end on a lot of factors- understanding how it effects your body requires experimentation.

I really cannot see the difference between 2 ius and 4 ius three months into my cycle, but now that the Test is kicking in, the synergy is noticeablevascularity and growth.

The is no magic recipe or everyone that made decent money would be huge.

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## realjo1000

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## plzr8

> I've ran it a few times now and I believe under the age of 30 GH isn't worth the money or nearly compare to the hype that ppl put on it.
> 
> Save your money and spend it on something worthwhile IMO.



agreed....i've discontinued hgh use for this reason, planning on starting back up again in a few years

maybe then the american stuff will be affordable too  :Wink/Grin:

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## RedBaron

> I must ask how can it be such a big difference between HGH and HGH ? It sounds very strange its like 100mg of test cant be stronger then 100mg of test just because its another brand the only thing is if one brand is underdosed but lets say jintropin which is a brand, HGH it should be correctly dosed so i dont understand how it can be such a difference.
> Im not saying you´re wrong but i just dont understand how because you have to admitt it sounds illogical.



Morgan Kane has already provided a good explanation of this, but I will give you a bit of an expanded explanation of a couple more things to consider. The fundamental difference is in the quality controls that are required for the American products vs. third world country products. I can go to my local pharmacy and pick up antibiotics, hormones, or whatever, and I have a REALLY good likelihood that the dosage is exactly as advertised with a extremely small potency variation from pill to pill, vial to vial, or whatever.

Now, if I were to fill the exact same prescription from a pharmacy in Mexico, China, or many other countries, I would likely end up with the right substance .... but in sometime pretty radically varying doses. There have been many tests on foreign prescriptions. Some of it is pretty close to on the money. Some of it is radically off, mostly underdosed but at times seriously overdosed ... a bit problem with some drugs. Some of it is just plain junk.

Jintropin is a Chinese HGH. It ISNT an American brand (just ask Sylvester Stallone about that one) or a "brand name" in the American sense. It is touted as the "largest seller" in China. But what does that really say. Iin the case of Chinese HGH, you have a few variables. We haven't actually seen their production facilities. Their claim is that it is of XYZ purity, but what substantiation do we really have? Do we know how stringent their quality control is on their product? How often and how much to they really test? The Chinese are "copy masters". You can send anything you want there and get back an exact replica. It most likely isn't going to be of the original quality, but it will look IDENTICAL. There have been a few "statements of purity" that have been sent to me to check out. Some of them were nothing more than rip off copies of the real deal. 

In the case of Jintropin and a few of the other foreign offerings, We have reasonable assurance it is what it says it is based on the results that many people receive. But the truth of the matter is they are just not controlled by an organization with the power of an FDA or any organization that would control, verify, and authenticate its strength. The US for all of its problems has the best medical care on the planet. We don't gain easy access to drugs because of all of the red tape, but when something does trickle through the red tape, what we end up with are some pretty verified drugs ... that cost about 100 times what they should of course. Those same controls don't exist in most of the rest of the world ... it is much more "buyer beware". That is certainly NOT to say that everything coming from other countries is bad ... it just requires a little bit of caution and experimentation. In my experience Jintropin and some of the other foreign offerings are fine products, and they work just like you would expect, albeit at different doses than prescription Humatrope or Genotropin.

So what we are left with is trial and error. What many have found is that there are some foreign offerings that seem to perform reasonably well at an affordable cost. Other offerings are garbage and should be avoided all together. But NONE of the foreign HGH I have ever seen has lived up to the premiere prescription brands found in the US. Whether due to inferior production facilities, inferior storage and shipping practices, or just due to the fact that it has to come half way around the world, I must say that 1 IU of Jintropin or Chinese XYZ HGH is NOT equilvalent to the same amount of any of the premiere American brands. That is why experimentation is in order to find the "sweet spot" as far as the right dose ... it is going to vary a bit from brand to brand when talking of the imports.

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## NewBreed

One has to take the receptor dowergulation into account, which happens to result in dimishing gains of the rh-GH... even 1IU of Jintropin the ver yfirst shot gave me sweats and the gh-sensation, after 6 months 3IUs didn´t do anything ... I think a three days on / 4 off-sheme would be great with gh and then really high dosing like 10IU/day. Gives effects nearly immediately and is the best way to get somehting out of it even in the short run, imho.

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