# MEMBERS EXPERIENCES > MEMBER'S CYCLE RESULTS >  Big Gains Cycle - Test-Prop/E Before&After - First Cycle

## JLCiscoPro

*Objectives:* To complete my first cycle employing both test-prop and test-e. Frontloading with the shorter ester to achieve faster results, while transitioning into a longer ester which I will continue for the length of 8 weeks. I would like to see how my body reacts to this and what I can accomplish. I am willing to do what it takes to achieve my fitness goals which are located in a section below. 

The most important things I wish to do in the next two months, more important than my fitness goals, are to avoid gynecomastia , keep a cool head above my shoulders, and avoid any injuries whatsoever.

*History:* I have been lifting weights for about 3 years, and have been working out for the last 18 months pretty steadily. My extended family is made up of pretty small people, Irish and Austrian, and I am one of the tallest and definitely the strongest. I am starting the cycle around 178 pounds, and I have just finished a dieting stretch. I was about 190 at my maximum before that. I am pretty sure I am close to max’ing out my “genetic potential” as no one on either side of my family has as much muscle as I do. As far as my history with supplements, I’ve been taking protein, creatine, and pre-workouts throughout the last couple of years. I’ve experimented with mild over-the-counter pro-hormones with decent results. 

*Stats:*
Age - 23
Height - 5’9
Weight - 178 lbs, just finished 2 months of dieting and fat burning


Squat (16 Reps) - 205
Bench Press (8 Reps) - 185
Dead Lift (8 Reps) - 225
Laying down tricep extensions, behind head - 10 x 85 lbs
Preacher Curls - 8 x 80 lbs

*Before Pictures:*
Back Double Bicep:

Quadricep:

Front Double Bicep:

Calf:




*The gear:* I have 600 mg of 100 mg/ml Test-Prop from a Russian Underground Lab, and 3500 mg of 350 mg/ml Test-E from the same lab (Oxide Laboratories). I am planning on front-loading with test-prop while transitioning into test-e, and running this cycle for 8 weeks total. I have Nolvadex on hand, about 40 pills. 10 are to combat any unwanted side effects, and I’m going to start taking quarter or half pills every fourth day when I feel the test really kick in in week three. I can increase that dosage with the onset of any undesirable effects.

*Additional supplements-*
Daily multivitamin - switching between Optimen and Centrum Men’s Health vitamins
Additional B-Complex vitmin by Nature’s Science, once daily
500 mg -1 gram daily Vitamin C by Ultimate Nutrition
Milk Thistle, 175 mg, twice daily for liver health. Looking into additional liver support.
Glucosamin Chondroitin, Proprietary blend by Walgreens, 1.5 Grams Glucosamine HCL + Other stuff, taken daily to improve joint health, cartilage strength, and joint lubrication. I think this will help if my muscles start pulling big weight and my joints are having a tough time keeping up.
My creatine is going to come solely from the pre-workout drinks (jack3d and caffeine free N.O. Xplode)

*Nutrition* - I’m not going to be counting calories (or anything for that matter) but I’m going to eat at least 4 times a day, and if I can, five or six times. I’m going to be taking in at least 250 grams of protein every single day and up to 400 some days. I will eat every 4 hours to avoid catabolic state. Most of this protein is going to come from actual food, and only 20% or less from protein shakes. I rarely eat sweets, and I eat a ton of fish and chicken. I have no qualms about eating beef, pork, or lamb. I will get a few veggie servings in every day. I am going to need enough carbs to fuel big workouts, thus I’m not going to be shy about eating carbs. Definitely will be eating low fat though, with the majority of my fats coming from milk and meat. I have whey and casein proteins on hand, and will often mix them or take the casein before bed. 




*The schedule:*
Day 1-3, 100 mg Test-P
Day 5 - 250 mg Test-E
Day 6 - 75 mg Test-P, 
Day 8 - 75 mg Test-P
Day 9 - 250 mg Test-E
Day 10 - 75 mg Test-P
Day 12 - 75 mg Test-P
Day 12 - 250 mg
Day 15 - 250 mg
Weeks4 through 8 - 500 mg, Test-E, Twice a week

Nolvadex taken as needed.
*
Post cycle therapy as described here: [URL="http://forums.steroid.com/showthread.php?209758-PCT-by-Steroid.com-%29"]http://forums.steroid.com/showthread.php?209758-PCT-by-Steroid.com-%29[/URL -*
Nolvadex Weeks 10-15 (20 mgs/day orally)
HCG Weeks 10-12 (500 iu/day)
Liquid Stane (Aromasin /Exemestane) Weeks 10-14 (25 mg/day)
Vitamin E (1 g/ day)
*
Goals:* My goal is to gain as much lean body mass as possible. If I put on some fat as well that is an okay side effect as far as I’m concerned. I want to have as much muscle mass as possible so when I start shredding fat mid-summer, the additional muscle mass will oxidize fat throughout the day, making it much easier. My goal for towards the end of summer is to have visible abs, and keep most of my muscle gains.
*
Time to get YOKED!*

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## JLCiscoPro

Day 1: First test-prop injection, 100 mg at about 11 P.M., decided to inject in my delt - don’t ever do this with Test-prop. First injection of test ever, felt an immediate lightheadedness, raised alertness. My friend said it was a placebo effect but I’m sure that it wasn’t. Tried to stand up and nearly fainted. Drank some water and felt okay. Took a high dose of sleeping medication and went to bed.

Day 2: Second test-prop injection, this time in the quadriceps, another mistake. I think my friends who told me to do these spots had done their first cycle with test-e, and had never hit a virgin muscle with test-prop. Listen to my advice, hit only your gluteal muscle with test-prop. If you want to have four injection points, I would recommend the quads second, but you’re not going to be lifting with your legs for at least 72 hours after the first time you put prop in your quad. 

Deltoid continues to be extremely sore. Appetite is incredible, I keep eating and eating and don’t get full. It’s kind of like when I used to smoke too much weed. Sex drive is already heightened. Not too much additional energy in the gym. Swam laps in the pool.

Day 3: Kind of a miserable day, deltoid and quadriceps muscles extremely sore. Very light red rash appearing for .75 inch radius all around the injeciton site in deltoid. Increased appetite. This is the third day of my frontloading, and this time I hit my glute. I almost feel nothing, this is definitely the best place to put test-prop. Soaked in the Jacuzzi for quite a while, definitely felt much better.

Day 4: No injections today. Here's a picture of the delt:



You can see there's some redness, I don't know if I would call it a rash.

Took my caffeinated pre-workout for the first time and definitely got a solid pump, worked out arms. Supersetted biceps and triceps, also did some light forearm excercises. Spent some time swimming laps (7 laps) and soaked in the Jacuzzi again.
I don’t remember every exercise, but worked out to failure in about 4-5 sets for both bi’s and tri’s, I call these my “work sets.” 


Day 5: Took my first test-e injection in the glute. Prepared the injection and ran the syringe under hot water. Then took a long hot shower and stretched my glute in the shower. Immediately got out, warmed the oil up some more, and stuck my self. Didn't get a perfect 90 degree angle because of the twisting to get my right glute, however, the injection was pretty painless during and since then (It has been 6 hours from when I'm writing this). 

Took Jack3d today and got a solid leg workout in. I read on the forums that working out the muscle you inject in (if not too painful) will help spread the oil. 

My deltoid is starting to feel a lot better, and the redness is clearing up. I am turning the corner and will not make that mistake again. 

Weighed in at 183 lbs before working out, so I’ve already added 5 pounds in 5 days; most of that is definitely water weight and I noticeably have added fat due to my incredible appetite.

Workout Log:
Glute Machine
10 x 60 lbs, four sets
Squats
16 x 135 lbs one set
16 x 185 lbs three sets
Hamstring Curls
12 x 90-120 lbs, four sets
Quadricep Extensions (Supersetted with hamstring curls)
10 x 100-120 lbs, four sets

Finished off with eight laps in the pool. My technique is definitely improving greatly, my breathing is getting better. I would have swam more but I had to be home.

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## Windex

> Nutrition - I’m not going to be counting calories (or anything for that matter) but I’m going to eat at least 4 times a day, and if I can, five or six times. I’m going to be taking in at least 250 grams of protein every single day and up to 400 some days. I will eat every 4 hours to avoid catabolic state. Most of this protein is going to come from actual food, and only 20% or less from protein shakes. I rarely eat sweets, and I eat a ton of fish and chicken. I have no qualms about eating beef, pork, or lamb. I will get a few veggie servings in every day. I am going to need enough carbs to fuel big workouts, thus I’m not going to be shy about eating carbs. Definitely will be eating low fat though, with the majority of my fats coming from milk and meat. I have whey and casein proteins on hand, and will often mix them or take the casein before bed


This paragraph alone shows how little you understand about what you are doing. If you are only 5 days in do yourself a huge favor and save your money (your gear isn't going to expire soon you still probably have another year or so) and stop the juicing. The above paragraph is poor and idiotic (No offense). Eating like you mentioned I guarantee with 100% certainly you will not keep a single pound gained a month after your cycle. Proper dieting is the pinnacle of successful bodybuilding and what you posted is simply not sufficient to feed new muscular tissue growth. Not too mention 4 meals is inadequate, lack of counting calories, changing how much your going to be eating on a regular basis.

Your diet (or lack thereof) is the primary reason that you think you require steroids to achieve your fitness goals. Your Squats and Deadlift numbers are lackluster. Heck, I Squat and Dlift more than you and I look like trash. You definitely haven't maxed out your genetic potential because you haven't been eating properly which is why you may have failed to see progress. Reaching your genetic potential means training and eating *correctly* with *zero* improvements in a period of ~8-12 months.

Steroids do not improve technique, they are no magic pill. Practice, training, researching, and coaching are what help with technique. I could continue but I think you get the picture. Sorry to be so blunt, but your making a huge mistake both to your body and your wallet by cycling. Fix your diet, get some coaching for training, and then in a year cycle once you've build a better foundation and have more knowledge about the nature of anabolic compounds.

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## JLCiscoPro

Thanks for the advice man. Unfortunately I'm not going to be taking it. From here on out I would like constructive criticism only that pertains to the cycle and what I can improve; I will not be stopping this cycle. 

As far as the nutrition piece, it's true that I was lazy in typing it out, but I would say I eat very well. I follow a diet according to Arnold's Encyclopedia of BodyBuilding pretty closely. I will work on the nutrition piece, but I'm not stopping the cycle.

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## JLCiscoPro

Day 6: Worked shoulders today.
Sets x Reps x Weight
Overhead Dumbell Press:
3 x 10 x 45 lb dumbells
1 x 8 x 60 lb dumbells
Overhead Cable Press:
4 x 10 x 40 lb
Behind the back Cable Lateral Raise:
2 x 10 x 20 lbs
Cable Lateral Raise
2 x 10 x 35 lbs
Posterior Delt Cable Raise
4 x 10 x 20 lbs
Shoulder Shrugs (weights in front of body)
6 sets x 8 reps x 35 pound plates in each hand
Shoulder Shrugs (weights almost behind buttocks)
6 sets x 8 reps x 35 pound plates in each hand

Day 7: Light workout today, Sunday is kind of a like a rest day, and I was teaching my friend how to lift so didn't go to hard.
Back
Sets x Reps x Weight
Did some warm up sets with light weight bent-over-barbell-row, then did three work sets:
Lat Pulldowns (bent bar)
1 x 90 x 12
1 x 110 x 10
1 x 120 x 8
1 x 130 x 8
T-bar Laying on Belly Rows
1 x 12 x 45 lbs
3 x 10 x 80 lbs
Bent-over Dumbell Rows, Dropsets
1 x 10 x 90 lb dumbell, into burnout with 30 lb dumbell
1 x 10 x 90 lb dumbell, finished workout

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## oldschoolfitness

dude you look to be in pretty good shape from the pics and i know you're not stopping the cycle, but it wouldn't have hurt to gain some more strength in the shoulder region. db presses and shrugs are way low you look stronger than that. battle with the log book and gain in weight or reps and everything will take care of itself. don't worry about a good pump and all that other junk get strong. good luck with the cycle .

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## terraj

A painful thread.


You are in no way ready for a cycle, your lifts are that of an average teenager. You stand a good chance of injury with any rapid strength gains you might get from your cycle.


Hahaa.. I love the comment "I was teaching my friend how to lift so didn't go to hard" .

Sorry kid :Smilie:

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## JLCiscoPro

> A painful thread.
> 
> 
> You are in no way ready for a cycle, your lifts are that of an average teenager. You stand a good chance of injury with any rapid strength gains you might get from your cycle.
> 
> 
> Hahaa.. I love the comment "I was teaching my friend how to lift so didn't go to hard" .
> 
> Sorry kid


I would imagine you don't have friends and all you do is take steorids and flame people on these forums...

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## Buddhabody

Good luck, and please be careful. I'm following.

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## GeSkill

225lbs deadlifts and you're close to your genetic potential?
Didn't that skinny dude from MTV Made do 250?

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## JLCiscoPro

dude I have back problems so deadlifts aren't a great measure of my strength.

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## JLCiscoPro

Day 6: Back

Day 7: Chest
Strength Gauge:
Dumbell press - 8 x 85 lb dumbells

Day 8: Hit Arms
SWIM has the log

Day 9: Legs 
Dumbell Lunges - 20 x 30 lb dumbells
Squats - 225 lbs, x 16 reps, 4 sets
Leg Press - 360 lbs, x 16 reps, 4 sets

Day 10: Cardio - 20 mins treadmill / Abs / 16 laps freestyle / 2 laps breast
Definitely looking harder into the nutrition piece. I really haven’t been eating like a bodybuilder does. I definitely need to trim some fat before summer and 6-packs are formed in the kitchen…

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## JLCiscoPro

Day 11-19:
So I haven’t been keeping a log every night, been super busy with work. BUT I have taken advice from people on here and did a TON of research on Nutrition. My new diet is as follows

800 - Mccanns Irish Oatmeal with Sugarfree Jam, half-scoop hydrolyzed whey protein and Flax Seed
OR 
5 Eggs w/ Avocado sliced in

1100 - half chicken (breast / wing, don‘t eat the skin) no condiments or skin
OR
Lunch meat stack with mustard / salt / pepper
2:30 - leftovers from whatever I bought at 11:00 because I’m at the office

5:30 Pre-workout nutrition, peanut butter (organic, ingredients=peanuts only) + Health Nut bread + ¾ of a banana sandwich OR turkey jerkey and health nut bread slices

8:30 Post-workout: on heavy lift days - 40 gram protein shake with yogurt and simple carbs in the form of some caramel syrup or other sweetener depending on what shake I buy at the nutrition shop, doing this to spike my insulin levels to increase protein absorption

9:00/9:30 - “dinner” - lunch meat stack, no bread or anything of course, or some turkey jerkey if im really lazy, or a can of chicken or tuna if I have the appetite

Before Bed (11:30) - Casein Protein or whey/casein blend

ALSO: I made a bunch of disgusting salads that consist of spinach, bok choi, carrots, cucumber, and peas. They really don’t taste good but I force them down plain. I really need to buy some sugar free/fat free dressing!!!

Please let me know what you guys think. 

Also my weight at Day 19 is about 183/184, so I’ve gained about 7 pounds so far, about a third into the cycle. 

Also it’s important to note that I have shredded a TON of fat in the last week since I started this diet. I’m not so sure this thread should be called “big gains” any more because my new goal is lean gains, as I saw I was gaining too much fat in the beginning when I was eating anything.

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## Windex

> dude I have back problems so deadlifts aren't a great measure of my strength.
> 
> 500 mg -1 gram daily Vitamin C by Ultimate Nutrition
> Milk Thistle, 175 mg, twice daily for liver health. Looking into additional liver support.
> Glucosamin Chondroitin, Proprietary blend by Walgreens, 1.5 Grams Glucosamine HCL + Other stuff, taken daily to improve joint health, cartilage strength, and joint lubrication. I think this will help if my muscles start pulling big weight and my joints are having a tough time keeping up.


Taking glucosamine is not going to help you with joints like you think it is. Tendons connect muscle to bone and ligaments connect bone to bone. When adding X pounds to Y exercise, Glucosamine is not going to lube you up. Tendons and ligaments are what are going to be torn. Feel free to slap on that extra 40 lbs to bench press, then tear your rotator cuff, it's going to feel like someone is ripping off your fingernails with a pair of clippers - got to witness it myself today from some clown who was clearly on juice with no knowledge whatsoever. Guess when he gets to go back to the gym ? Oh yeah, next year. You really need to research more. Glucosamine is used primarily for people with arthritis or several sports injuries that have created joint problems over time. Powerlifting long-term problems and Winstrol are what brought the supplement to the bodybuilding regime. Exactly what is "joint health" to you ?

Why do you think you need additional liver support ? Where did you get 175g x2 a day from ? I take 500mg/day and consider it excessive. Your not even taking oral steroids (I am praying that you don't think Milk Thistle will counteract drinking alcohol while your on cycle).

Lmfao, deadlift is part of the big 3, if you can't Deadlift why are you at the gym. [Exception = Torn ligament/muscle/tendon to prevent leg exercises]. Not training properly = increase chance of injury, pain, and problems. Your 7 pounds gained is probably 5 pounds of water, 1 pound of muscle, and 1 pound of fat.

Your diet is beyond terrible, not only will you look worse than before, you will also be more unhealthy. You buy fast food every day shows how ignorant you are to dieting. Guess what they bake the chicken in ? Oil and a ton of it. Taking of the skin from those hot counter chicken dishes is like not eating the cone on a tripe stacked ice cream cone. Lunch meats are processed rubbish. Your "dinner" has no fats or carbs. Protein meals are next to useless with the exception of PWO or Casein pre-bed.

Your squats have only increased 20 pounds, pathetic. I went from 225 to 270 lbs in squats in 3 weeks, NATURALLY.

Being blunt is the only way you will understand what you doing is incredibly moronic. Congrats on wasting money on gear and potentially ruining your body for the rest of your life.

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## lovbyts

I wont be fallowing this. So far I read anyone who does not agree with what you are doing you will just act like a 10 yr old and insult them, say they dont have any friends and basically show your lack of understanding or learning by saying you wont listen to them. I see another hall of shame in the making. I dont think we will be seeing much more than a mess with this post.

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## Windex

> I wont be fallowing this. So far I read anyone who does not agree with what you are doing you will just act like a 10 yr old and insult them, say they dont have any friends and basically show your lack of understanding or learning by saying you wont listen to them. I see another hall of shame in the making. I dont think we will be seeing much more than a mess with this post.


Wait is this direct at me or the OP ?

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## lovbyts

> Wait is this direct at me or the OP ?


At the OP of course. LOL

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## MastaMan

> *Objectives:* Ive experimented with mild over-the-counter pro-hormones with decent results.


 I am of a similar age and experience level, and have a bottle of CEL h drol on hand. Where your experiences with ph/ps positive? My biggest fear is that by using it i will permanently damage my endocrine system and not be able to reach the same level that i might have reached had i not used them. Also, how much did your bench squat and deadlift go up, and how much weight did you keep from them?

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## vx1000

> I am of a similar age and experience level, and have a bottle of CEL h drol on hand. Where your experiences with ph/ps positive? My biggest fear is that by using it i will permanently damage my endocrine system and not be able to reach the same level that i might have reached had i not used them. Also, how much did your bench squat and deadlift go up, and how much weight did you keep from them?


If you're age and experience level are similar to the OPs, then you don't need a PH. I am an average, middle of the road, guy are far as genetics go, and at the very least a 315lbs squat and a 405 deadlift were stupid easy to achieve, even while I was still kinda figuring out/learning how I should train and eat. I am also about the same age and size as the OP and I currently don't even see the point in using anything. Strength gains are the main goal right now and they are coming in steady. Diet is dialed in, same thing everyday, 7 days a week, no booze, sleep schedule is the same every night, lift smart 7 days a week. Those things have made a WORLD of difference for me, the effects have been almost "drug like".

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## brad1986

> Thanks for the advice man. Unfortunately I'm not going to be taking it. From here on out I would like constructive criticism only that pertains to the cycle and what I can improve; I will not be stopping this cycle. 
> 
> As far as the nutrition piece, it's true that I was lazy in typing it out, but I would say I eat very well. I follow a diet according to Arnold's Encyclopedia of BodyBuilding pretty closely. I will work on the nutrition piece, but I'm not stopping the cycle.


Dude you should never go past 2-3 hours without eating... if your waiting 4 hours to eat then you are catabolic for severeal hours of your waking day

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## MastaMan

> Dude you should never go past 2-3 hours without eating... if your waiting 4 hours to eat then you are catabolic for severeal hours of your waking day


I read somewhere that eating too frequently/much suppresses GH, as insulin and growth hormone do not exactly "get along"...

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## MastaMan

> If you're age and experience level are similar to the OPs, then you don't need a PH. I am an average, middle of the road, guy are far as genetics go, and at the very least a 315lbs squat and a 405 deadlift were stupid easy to achieve, even while I was still kinda figuring out/learning how I should train and eat. I am also about the same age and size as the OP and I currently don't even see the point in using anything. Strength gains are the main goal right now and they are coming in steady. Diet is dialed in, same thing everyday, 7 days a week, no booze, sleep schedule is the same every night, lift smart 7 days a week. Those things have made a WORLD of difference for me, the effects have been almost "drug like".


 It's not that i am lazy, but rather i am interested in the fact that PH/PS or AAS use would allow me to train more often and aggressively... btw how on earth are you training 7 days a week without being overtrained? Are your workouts 15 minutes long?

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