# COMPETITIVE BODYBUILDING - POWERLIFTING - ATHLETICS & SPORTS > BOXING / FIGHTING / WRESTLING >  what to learn for real world fighting

## traindude

what should i learn if i want to defend?
bjj?
wrestling?

where should i start?

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## DanB

how to swing a pool cue, bar stool, glass etc  :Smilie: 

but if all you want is self defense then look up some of the dedicated self defense classes in your area

they will be more suited then anything as they will go straight into showing you how to disarm somebody etc while any type of MA or contact sport will teach you the sport more then self defense, that will come as your skill level grows but it wont be based around it like a dedicated self defense class will be

make sense?

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## Dukkit

Krav Maga

The art of how to fukk someone up just enough so that you can get away. 

Its pretty nasty

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## BigBadWolf

I preferr 12ga shot gun. It the best.

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## Times Roman

it really depends on how much effort you are willing to put into it.

are you prepared to spend the next 8 years mastering an art, or are you more interested in a summer course?

the first thought i have is if you punch a guy, he should go down if a similar size. if you can't do this, then you don't know how / where to punch. many don't. if a guy is down, he aint hitting back right away.

learning how to punch (whole body punch means putting your hips/shoulders into it, stepping in and nailing the bastard) doesn't take long to learn.

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## revo_romero

The only move you'll need to know is the Mortal Kombat leg sweep..Works every time!

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## JAB1

Krav maga is good. Muay thai for stand up and bjj for ground are my favs, even for real life. Alot of fights go to the ground, so you def want to know what to do once there. However for street fights I recomend staying standing if at all possible becuase if you go to the ground even if your winning/submitting that is when the buddies will jump in to kick you while your down, etc. In a street fight your goal should not be "winning", it should be doing immediate damage and getting out of situation asap, actual fighting should only ensue if you have no escape route.

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## yannick35

Groin kick kyokushin karate style. Krav maga is nasty, and will get you in amazing shape too. It also depends on how much of a bad a$ your are, people say tae kwon do is worthless but i saw some of my friends kick butt in clubs when i was younger with TDK, the jumping back kick is very effective when in close on a dance floor LOL, Theses where the times.

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## SwellingUp

I prefer to avoid fighting I really am just afraid to hurt some one too bad I used to look for em when I was a kid and learned my lesson.

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## lca5000

> what should i learn if i want to defend?
> bjj?
> wrestling?
> 
> where should i start?


Thai boxing 
Knees as the person shoots in use the knees 
Thai clinch learn how to control a person body.

the other day I was sparing with a mate of mine who has just taken up wing chun. Him not knowing I did that style of fighting years ago {so I knew the movements and how he was going to attack}
As soon I clinch him and ragged him about a little and a few knees later I realised he was clueless to the clinch as the same with a lot of martial arts that don't use it.
I do quite a bit of boxing and I found the same there. A good clinch game will help alot 

I say go with Thai boxing

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## blainer

Krav Maga is the art of ball kicking and eye gouging. lol. I do Thai boxing but it's not for everyone. A lot of bruised shins and feet and ribs. Most street brawls end up on the ground so it's good to learn how to control a situation and always learn a little bit of joint manipulation. I usually find though that a good kick to the inside of the knee ends most situations quickly. That being said, if you ever get into a fight with someone and hurt them badly and they find out that you box or do mma or any of that they will place most of the blame on you and say you should have known how to control the situation better. I have seen friends end up in Jail when I was in the Marines just because someone swung at them and they broke the guys arm or jaw. The judge and cops say that you are trained and should know when to pull back, but you could always argue the heat of the moment claim and say that you got caught up in the moment and went beast mode. lol. Now that my rant is done.... lol. Basicly the best way is to avoid fighting all together but if you train up and be ready for a situation it's a good thing. Just be prepared to fight in court after you beat an attackers ass to defend your actions. Just remember totality of facts. Justify your actions in a step by step this is what happened kind of explanation.

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## Vangeif

Depends on how long you're willing to stay committed to something, and what your priorities are. If you're just looking for a quick way to learn how to defend yourself, then krav maga is a good choice since it doesn't take long to learn and is a good self-defense system. If you're looking for a long-term commitment to learn something that is not only good in self-defense situation, as well as having the option of learning about culture, some history, mastery of an art, and possibly spiritual enlightenment, my recommendations would be judo or ninjutsu. Both of these art forms are practical in self-defense purposes so long as you learn judo traditionally (despite what the ignorant majority say, judo has a ton of self-defense techniques, and all of these claims are conducted out of ignorance or MMA gyms). Ninjtsu is obvious, but finding a legitimate place to learn ninjutsu might be more difficult, so I'd look more into judo since it fulfills the priorities of self-defense, culture/ history, mastery of an art, spiritual enlightenment, and is an applicable form in mixed martial arts if you're also considering that.

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## Times Roman

> what should i learn if i want to defend?
> bjj?
> wrestling?
> 
> where should i start?


mate, i spent a miniscule 3+ years studying tae kwon do as a kid, plus a little kung fu here and there (well, I used to wrestle too for awhile). i say this as i now feel that the total time I invested in training wasn't as effective as it could have been. so let me ask you....

what are your goals?

how much time and effort are you willing to spend?

do you only want to spend a summer learning how to fight, or several years?

how you answer these questions will determine the most effective way of investing your time in learning how to fight.

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## BBeagle

> I preferr 12ga shot gun. It the best.


 :Thumps Up: 

my Colt KC .357 takes care for me and my family

traindude: you can learn a basic combo of judo,boxing & some nasty punches and kicks. go with a MMA instructor and tell what you need. buy some heavy bag and practice

and one more thing: the best confrontation is the one you can avoid

cheers

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## ziggypiggy

take every post here with a grain of salt. Any question even remotely similar to "what is the best martial art?" gets immediately translated to "What martial art do YOU do?". Most of the time, people will just tell you the martial art that they study, because they are convinced that it is the best.

I studied wing chun for about 10 years. I think it's a decent martial art for self defense, mainly because it is taught as a combat martial art, and not as a competitive/tournament martial art. Most martial arts that are centered around tournaments and competitions usually aren't as good, since what you're learning is how to win a competition, not how to defend yourself. There are many techniques that are great for self defense that would be banned in competitions. I can't answer the question as to what martial art is best for self defense, because I have to experience with any other than wing chun.

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## rhanor

boxing or muay thai for standup and wrestling for ground. some ppl say bjj which is great but if you master the takedown you can get on top of someone and pound them.

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## ImBlue

The best one is the one that intrest you enough to master it.. I seen some guys take muay thai and wuss out after hitting their shin on the wood pole.. There is a martial art for everyone, try the freebie day and see if it'll intrest you long enough to master it

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## grappler11

I am biased, but I believe that BJJ is the best self defense art for the everyday man. Muai Thai is a brutal art, but not many have the endurance to take the day to day damge, geting kicked in the legs every day ect..... 

Wrestling is not something that you learn, it is something do. If you haven't already grown up a a wrestler than it is most likely to late. 

I think that Krav Maga is something that should be done as an annual camp. BJJ, boxing, MT all have rules, Krav Maga reminds us that yes, we can punch the balls!

BJJ is an art that is learned, and practiced at near full speed, rough enough to get a good look at combat everyday, but saves the body to train for many more years.

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## Far from massive

I hate these Fvn threads almost as much as I hate the idiots going on mainstream tv showing how to break a trachia with a palm strike to the back of a positioned hand.

Krav Magra was designed by militant Jews to subdue those percieved to be of a lesser race ( Did these people lean anything in WW2 ?) and has no place being used as a way to resolve a non lethal situation that could have been walked away from (bar fight).

If you want to enter fights that could have been walked away from then by all means learn dirty boxing, Thai boxing etc. 

BJJ and God forbid Krav Magra or much better suited to defending oneself from a gang rape or home invasion when a firearm is not at hand. 

If you have no morals so you don't mind inflicting possible permanent damage on someone...keep in mind you may find yourself in court and most judges will not have much sympathy for you when you say the guy was really swinging so thats why you broke his elbow/knee or gouged out his eye or collapsed his trachia.

PS rant over  :Icon Rolleyes:

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## red_hulk

If you want to learn something you can use realistically instead of just for sport or to get you into shape you're kind of limited haha. You need to know what's good for you and your body type and you also need to study a style that is mainly stand up. 

Don't get me wrong, wrestling and bjj are great, especially for exercise. But when it comes to the street it can get you killed, literally. When it comes to realistic fighting you dont want to go to the ground and always want to be in a stable fighting stance. 

When I first started martial arts I began with tae kwon do but that's more of a sport and is kind of impractical. I moved on to something called American combat karate, which is basically just street fighting. We spar full contact no pads and practice against practical weapons and multiple opponents, because how often do you fight just one person? I dont know where you're located but there are a few ack schools around the country. 

A few people suggested krav maga or Maui tai, those along with boxing or Wing chun kung fu are great for practical realistic training. But like I said, you need to find something mainly stand up and if they don't teach how to handle yourself against more than one person it's not worth Paying for.

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## red_hulk

I'd like to add that I'm not against training bjj or wrestling. We even practice it at our school, but only so we know what to do if we come across it. We're discouraged from going to the ground in a real fight situation.

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## Viking13

I'm not saying Any of this to toot my own horn. Just offering actual perspective from someone who has applied this in a day to day basis in the most dynamic of circumstances. Not just in a controlled environment, which seems to be where the majority of these responses come from. 

I started out in wrestling as a kid and
Continued through college and still train it and have coached middle and high school. Had some kung fu and earned a bb in traditional japanese jj growing up. Moved on to judo after high school and college. Went to bjj after some time in judo and have boxed on and off for about 12 years. I am now a first degree bb in bjj. A brown belt in judo (never picked back up training after I left) and now teach combatives to people in my line of work and the military. 

My thoughts are this: basic wrestling and western boxing are ideal for self defense. If you can take someone down and control them you are one step ahead of the game. There are plenty of crude holds learned from wrestling, greco or folkstyle/freestyle, that can be applied effectively in the Street And good ole western boxing is a no brainier. I've seen many a haymaker thrown in the form of a sucker punch only to be blocked and countered with an uppercut and a dude be out cold for his efforts. 

Have I used bjj in my line of work? Absolutely! I'm Glad I took all the years to learn and train. However, most people don't have the luxury that I did to eat sleep and train as a job. Before actually having to get a real job. Wrestling is something you can learn at any age and be effective, and boxing as well. The goal is to not learn 100 takedowns and combinations and be kinda ok at them It's to learn 5-6 of each that work for you and master them. Then you can do some damage. Find a good school or wrestling club and train as much as u can My 2 cents.

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## gixxerboy1

> I'd like to add that I'm not against training bjj or wrestling. We even practice it at our school, but only so we know what to do if we come across it. We're discouraged from going to the ground in a real fight situation.


i agree




> I'm not saying Any of this to toot my own horn. Just offering actual perspective from someone who has applied this in a day to day basis in the most dynamic of circumstances. Not just in a controlled environment, which seems to be where the majority of these responses come from. 
> 
> I started out in wrestling as a kid and
> Continued through college and still train it and have coached middle and high school. Had some kung fu and earned a bb in traditional japanese jj growing up. Moved on to judo after high school and college. Went to bjj after some time in judo and have boxed on and off for about 12 years. I am now a first degree bb in bjj. A brown belt in judo (never picked back up training after I left) and now teach combatives to people in my line of work and the military. 
> 
> My thoughts are this: basic wrestling and western boxing are ideal for self defense. If you can take someone down and control them you are one step ahead of the game. There are plenty of crude holds learned from wrestling, greco or folkstyle/freestyle, that can be applied effectively in the Street And good ole western boxing is a no brainier. I've seen many a haymaker thrown in the form of a sucker punch only to be blocked and countered with an uppercut and a dude be out cold for his efforts. 
> 
> Have I used bjj in my line of work? Absolutely! I'm Glad I took all the years to learn and train. However, most people don't have the luxury that I did to eat sleep and train as a job. Before actually having to get a real job. Wrestling is something you can learn at any age and be effective, and boxing as well. The goal is to not learn 100 takedowns and combinations and be kinda ok at them It's to learn 5-6 of each that work for you and master them. Then you can do some damage. Find a good school or wrestling club and train as much as u can My 2 cents.


the last place you want to be is on the ground. I wrestled from age 5 through college. won in the state torunements and fought mma. In a bar fight you do not want to be on the ground. There are bottles and shit on the ground, your opened to getting kicked by someone watching, a friend of the other person.

In all my fights in a bar. Unfortunately i've been in many. i also bounced in bars for years. I went to the ground once. And the kid tackled me. He ended up unconscious and the bouncer trying to break it up leaving in an ambulance from broken glass on the floor of the club.

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## Lunk1

COMMUNICATION!!!! If you are smart, mature, avoid places and ppl that will most likely put you in a fight then it is the best defense you can have. When I was young I was invincable. Now due to my profession I have to fight on occasion but when I do I fight as if I am fight in for my life not because I want to prove how bad I am or am not. Yhe older I get the longer it takes ny wounds to heal. I have learned the time tested self defense art of control!

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## Honkey_Kong

The best skill to learn for real-world fighting is how to avoid getting in to fights. You can't lose a fight if you don't get in one. And no matter how good at fighting you get, there is always somebody better at it than you are.

Fighting should be reserved for life and death situations.

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## Lunk1

> The best skill to learn for real-world fighting is how to avoid getting in to fights. You can't lose a fight if you don't get in one. And no matter how good at fighting you get, there is always somebody better at it than you are.
> 
> Fighting should be reserved for life and death situations.


Amen!

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## spywizard

> Krav maga is good. Muay thai for stand up and bjj for ground are my favs, even for real life. Alot of fights go to the ground, so you def want to know what to do once there. However for street fights I recomend staying standing if at all possible becuase if you go to the ground even if your winning/submitting that is when the buddies will jump in to kick you while your down, etc. In a street fight your goal should not be "winning", it should be doing immediate damage and getting out of situation asap, actual fighting should only ensue if you have no escape route.


thanks, now i don't have to type it..

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## Viking13

> i agree
> 
> the last place you want to be is on the ground. I wrestled from age 5 through college. won in the state torunements and fought mma. In a bar fight you do not want to be on the ground. There are bottles and shit on the ground, your opened to getting kicked by someone watching, a friend of the other person.
> 
> In all my fights in a bar. Unfortunately i've been in many. i also bounced in bars for years. I went to the ground once. And the kid tackled me. He ended up unconscious and the bouncer trying to break it up leaving in an ambulance from broken glass on the floor of the club.


Everyone's experiences are unique and subjective to that individual. 90% of fights end up on the ground, that's a police statistic not mine. I've bounced in bars and can tell you for sure thT I would rather know bjj and wrestling than not know it. I've also worked in some of the roughest projects in the region and not once has knowing any form of grappling failed me. I agree with you to an extent regarding situational awareness, but one would be a fool to not learn some form of grappling to have a better understanding of tactics in any given situation. A fight is dynamic in nature, not static.

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## gixxerboy1

> Everyone's experiences are unique and subjective to that individual. 90% of fights end up on the ground, that's a police statistic not mine. I've bounced in bars and can tell you for sure thT I would rather know bjj and wrestling than not know it. I've also worked in some of the roughest projects in the region and not once has knowing any form of grappling failed me. I agree with you to an extent regarding situational awareness, but one would be a fool to not learn some form of grappling to have a better understanding of tactics in any given situation. A fight is dynamic in nature, not static.


oh i agree with you. But if we are taking someone who is a blank slate and only going to learn one thing. A ground game isnt what i would pick. Yes the more well rounded you are the better.

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## Lunk1

I have seen high school wrestlers tie golden gloves boxers up like a pretzel in the blink of an eye and I have seen 19 year old street kid knock out a black belt. Rule of thumb is don't worry about learning how to DEFEND yourself. Worry about how to win! The best defense in this case is a solid offense. Strike hard, strike fast and most of all strike FIRST!

If that doesn't work use the hold back method "Drillbit Taylor Movie" lol.

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## Times Roman

> I have seen high school wrestlers tie golden gloves boxers up like a pretzel in the blink of an eye and I have seen 19 year old street kid knock out a black belt. Rule of thumb is don't worry about learning how to DEFEND yourself. Worry about how to win! *The best defense in this case is a solid offense. Strike hard, strike fast and most of all strike FIRST!*
> If that doesn't work use the hold back method "Drillbit Taylor Movie" lol.


I'm always amazed that when it comes to it, how many hesistate when they should be swinging. I would suggest that hesitation loses 90% of most fights between "lay" people.

The bottom line, if it looks like a fight is eminent, deck the fukker before he decks you! this will win 90% of the time, unless you tangle with someone that actually knows what they are doing.

There is no dishonor in losing a fight...

....there is MUCH dishonor in getting your ass whipped and not attempting to fight back.  :Nutkick:

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## Viking13

> oh i agree with you. But if we are taking someone who is a blank slate and only going to learn one thing. A ground game isnt what i would pick. Yes the more well rounded you are the better.


I gotcha, I agree 100%. I tell guys all the time bjj wouldn't be my first choice due to the amount of time it truly takes to become proficient in it. It takes time to develop muscle memory, and if you ain't got time then pick boxing or Thai.

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## Lunk1

> I'm always amazed that when it comes to it, how many hesistate when they should be swinging. I would suggest that hesitation loses 90% of most fights between "lay" people.
> 
> The bottom line, if it looks like a fight is eminent, deck the fukker before he decks you! this will win 90% of the time, unless you tangle with someone that actually knows what they are doing.
> 
> There is no dishonor in losing a fight...
> 
> ....there is MUCH dishonor in getting your ass whipped and not attempting to fight back.


Always amazes me! Less talking, more knocking a fuker out! If I want to argue I will talk to my wife!

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## mightymic

Actual fighting is about mindset, situational awareness, physical conditioning and skills combined. There is no "yoda" and there is no "holy grail."

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## truestrength

> what should i learn if i want to defend?
> bjj?
> wrestling?
> 
> where should i start?


Wing Chun is very effective in streetfighting......you can pick up the basics in about 6 months.
Then I would either add or switch to Thai boxing, Kajukenbo, Judo, or Aikido if you have the time.

If not......just go take boxing lessons and a few months later hit the streets.....
On the street fancy moves get you killed - a real fight usually lasts no more than 10secs - unless both people don`t know how to fight LOL

I`ve been practicing Martial Arts for 30 years
Teaching for 15 years
and I`m a professional Bodyguard (since 2000)

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## TOkidd

Those who responded that all they need are their .357's, 12GA's, etc. maybe didn't read the title of the post. The OP is asking about learning self-defense - any idiot can learn how to pull a trigger and end a man's life. It takes far more courage and self-discipline to learn the art of self defense, or martial arts like Jiu Jitsu. 

Here in Canada, we're allowed to own rifles, shotguns and handguns, but the difference between Canada and the US is not only how much more traning one needs to own a gun, how much longer we have to wait between applying for gun ownership and actually being able to buy one, but more importantly a different attitude, where all but young, ignorant gangbangers and psychopaths see the use of a gun as a cowardly and unnecessary act. Unless there is an intruder in my house threatening me and my family, I would never consider using a gun against another person. In Canada, we're not allowed to carry handguns in the street, which prevents countless murders by otherwise law-abiding citizens who are put in a situation where they are angered or humiliated, and in a heat of passion respond with gunfire (the Zimmerman case is one of dozens every year in the US. It only got publicity because of the spurious racial issues invloved). So many people say they own guns to protect themselves, and that if more people owned guns, massacres like those in Colorado or Virginia Tech wouldn't happen. But let me give you a statistic: In 2007, there were 12,632 firearm-related homicides in the US. Do you think there were even 100 cases of legitimate firearm-related self-defense deaths in that same year? 200? 50? When have you ever heard of a massacre being stopped by a citizen carrying a firearm? 

I'm not trying to hijack this thread, but I simply don't think jingoistic statements about firearms has any place in a forum about Self Defense and Martial Arts. As an avid hunter, this is not coming from some anti-gun extremist. But I can tell you that training in Jiu Jitusi can allow any person to defend themselves against a much larger attacker, or multiple attackers, unarmed and armed. Taking the time to undertake this training seems much more reasonable and respectable than carrying a handgun around with you everywhere you go in the off-chance you will be in a position where the use of that firearm is absolutely necessary. It's far more likely you'll end up using it in a moment of fear or anger, landing yourself in prison, and adding another number to that horrible statistic I mentioned above. 

In response to the OP, if you are not just looking for a six-week course, Japanese Jiu-Jitsu is probably the most effective, practical means of self-defense there is. There's a reason why Special Forces around the world use it in their training. And you don't need to be a black belt to be able to defend yourself. After a year of training, your average person won't stand a chance against you in a fight.

TOkidd

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## martymcfly85

I would say go with any ground fighting technique, it can be wicked effective. Nothing like choking out some asshole who wont shut his mouth. Pull guard right into a Triangle choke  :Smilie:

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## ScotchGuard02

Out of Aikido, Kenpo, Tae Kwan Do, and kickboxing that I've done over the last 30 years I think the fastest way to learn self defense is boxing. If learn how to throw a jab, cross, and balance your weight you can go a long way.

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## martymcfly85

> Out of Aikido, Kenpo, Tae Kwan Do, and kickboxing that I've done over the last 30 years I think the fastest way to learn self defense is boxing. If learn how to throw a jab, cross, and balance your weight you can go a long way.



i second that!

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## gixxerboy1

> I would say go with any ground fighting technique, it can be wicked effective. Nothing like choking out some asshole who wont shut his mouth. Pull guard right into a Triangle choke


yea, pull guard on the street where there can be broken glass or what ever.Or be on the ground if there is multiple attackers. Someone pulls guard on cement with me in a fight im going to bounce their head off the pavement. 

My friend competes in BJJ he is pretty good. Won a bunch of comps. Well we were at a club and shit started. So his reaction was the same as yours. He grabbed the kid pulled gaurd, then got stopped in the face by someone else. Ended up with a broken nose and getting his ass kicked.

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## Verceti

"dont you teach them knife fighting, teach them to kill. that way when they meet a son of a bitch that studied knife fighting.. theyll send his soul to hell"

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## tankerlife4ever

Krav Maga...Israeli defence force fighting system...think caught without a gun and surrounded by people who want to drag your torso naked down the street. Truly real world self defence survival

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