# MEMBERS EXPERIENCES > MEMBER'S CYCLE RESULTS >  First Cycle - Test Cyp 400mg/wk for 10wks

## smashingbox

*AGE:* 26
*WEIGHT:* 75kg - Yes I would have liked to be a bit bigger before starting
*BODYFAT:* ~13%
*HEIGHT:* 5'10

I have been training for close to 4 years now, I was in the best shape of my life and ready to cycle a couple of months ago but had an operation and had to take some time off, so the next 2 weeks (before the test kicks in) I will be bringing myself back up to scratch and then hope to go above and beyond with this cycle. I have been researching for quite a while and am really aiming to get the most out of this cycle.

Cycle is simple, test only for 10 weeks.
*WEEKS 1 - 10:* Test Cyp 400mg/wk, 2 x 1ml shots Sunday night/Thursday morning 
*WEEKS 3-12:* HCG 250ui x2 per week

-Arimidex on hand, will use at 0.25mg EOD if high est sides develop.
-Considering adding Winny for last 3-4 weeks of cycle to consolidate gains and firm up muscle before coming off.

*PCT*
Starting 14 days after last shot of Test Cyp.
Clomid: 25mg/ED for 4 weeks
Torem: 60mg/ED for 4 weeks
DAA: ~3g per day for 1 month
Vitamin C
Will start using creatine, and pre-workout sups to offset any loss of intensity. 

I plan on following this basic routine for the duration of the cycle:
*Day 1* - Chest and Biceps
*Day 2* - Legs
*Day 3* - Rest
*Day 4* - Shoulders and Triceps
*Day 5* - Back and Abs
*Day 6* - Rest
*Day 7* - Rest

I will also be running 2-3 times per week, 30 mins intense cardio.

*DIET:* Currently getting around 3500 cals a day but will adjust upwards when necessary. Typical day is as follows:

7am Steak (approx 175g) all fat trimmed
8am Shake (40g whey protein + 300ml low fat milk + 90g oats)
10am Small chicken breast (roasted) with veggies
12pm Healthy burger or Chicken Kebab (97% fat free)
4.30pm 200g lean mince beef and sweet potato
5.30pm  6.30pm work out
6.30pm Shake (40g whey protein + 300ml low fat milk + 90g oats) + 10g Glutamine
8.30pm ~200g atlantic salmon fillet and cous cous.
10pm Steak

I will also supplement with Jack3d before workout for first 2 weeks, BCAAs during workouts, multi vitamin once per day, and fish oil.

First shot 22nd May, 1ml/200mg straight into the quad. It was far easier than I thought and went down without a problem at all. I have to say that after waiting soooooo long to finally do this cycle I am very excited for the next 10 weeks!! 

Ok I think that is everything, will post some before pics.

Any productive comments are welcomed, including any negative feedback.

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## smashingbox



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## xnotoriousx

Good luck! You should get great results. I'll be checking in to see your progress.

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## 38jumper38

You my want to improve your diet.

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## Bigd89

Nowhere near ready to cycle. You can get up to 200lbs naturally...

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## RDW

I never had any sides at 400 a week....over 500mg a week its always good to be cautious, but you never know.

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## Buddhabody

Good luck to you bro.........

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## smashingbox

LOL at the geneticist with access to my complete DNA profile Bigd89... you can get 300lbs naturally mate go for it.

I don't want to be 200lbs, and I don't really want to do it naturally either. But that is a debate for another thread.

Thanks to others. I have all ancillaries on hand just in case of sides though I hope not to encounter any.

38jumper38, could you be more specific? Any suggestions?

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## Bigd89

How much were you weighing when you we're "in the best shape of my life a couple months ago" ?? Gotta be more than 165lbs...

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## oldschoolfitness

what are your goals bro?? just wondering cause you said didn't care about reaching 200. are you looking to end up around 180 or just gain some strength ?? not trying to bash ya; just think it will make the thread more intresting . good luck

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## FlyingNun

Looking to do similar cycle with similar stats. Interested to see this progress! good luck!

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## Gucks

> *AGE:* 26
> *WEIGHT:* 75kg - Yes I would have liked to be a bit bigger before starting *that is pretty light like bigd said, but if ur 26 with 4 years of serious training, (not just fvucking about in the gym without a diet) then go 4 it i think. u can still make gains anturally afterwards.*
> *BODYFAT:* ~13%
> *HEIGHT:* 5'10
> 
> I have been training for close to 4 years now, I was in the best shape of my life and ready to cycle a couple of months ago but had an operation and had to take some time off, so the next 2 weeks (before the test kicks in) I will be bringing myself back up to scratch and then hope to go above and beyond with this cycle. I have been researching for quite a while and am really aiming to get the most out of this cycle.
> 
> Cycle is simple, test only for 10 weeks.
> *WEEKS 1 - 10:* Test Cyp 400mg/wk, 2 x 1ml shots Sunday night/Thursday morning 
> ...


i think u shuld make a thread in the diet forum of ur diet. u need 2 work out a full breakdown of ur macros to make the most of ur cycle, 75% of u gaining muscle will be down to ur diet and not to gear. diet is pretty descent. wuld need full macros 4 any1 2 critique properly though.

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## smashingbox

Thanks for the input so far guys.

To answer your question I was at one point 82kg but that was after a big bulking routine (Max-OT) and a CRAZY diet (my pre bedtime meal was 60g protein, 90g oats, 60g maltodextrin, 2 tablespoons of peanut butter, ice cream and full cream milk)... so my bf might have been around 14-15% then I cut weight and cut down to maybe 11-12%bf... but was only around 80kg. So that was essentially my peak. Yes I know it doesn't sound like much of a peak but I was/am, an extreme ectomorph, I started at 60kg and have spent a few years building up my base strength and training and dieting. I feel confident I can get back to around 80kg within the next few weeks and then the test should kick in and hopefully sling shot me up a bit higher.

You'll notice that my cycle is fairly modest, being only 400mg for 10 weeks, not exactly crazy amounts of gear. I am using the gear to enhance the results I would achieve naturally, not as a crutch to hold up an otherwise poor program.

I guess my goals are ultimately to be around 85-87kg, but then I just want to be lean. I figure that if I want to be 87kg with say 8% bf... then I need to be around 90kg at 13% before I cut (check my maths). I honestly don't believe I could achieve that naturally, but who knows. I don't really know what to expect with this cycle but what I would really like is to make as much LEAN muscle gains as possible. My plans long term are to run this cycle and make solid gains, keep as much as possible and then maybe next year run test/tren cycle to lean up...

Ok on to my diet, I will just say quickly to Gucks... I have the steak as soon as I wake up, literally 5 mins to cook and then I eat it, then I have a shower and get ready for work and drink the shake on my way to work. It is the easiest way for me to get early morning carbs and it is more or less straight away... that should be almost perfect right? I get a load of protein and carbs straight up. Then for my next meal I have chicken breast with veggies, this is the most sedentary part of my day (desk job) so I avoid any more carbs. Then at lunch this is my meal with most room for improvement, we all go out for lunch but I always choose something relatively healthy, subway, chicken kebab (low fat, salad, wheat tortilla). In the afternoon before my workout I eat lean mince and sweet potato so this is protein and carbs to fuel my work out. BCAAs through my workout, then a whey protein shake with oats for PWO carbs. Then I eat salmon which has obviously got good fats and protein with cous cous for carbs. Then steak right before bed to give me slow digesting protein through the night. 

Here are my macros:

*Macros in P/C/F*

*7:30am*
Steak 180g 48/0/16 350 cals
Shake 65/75/11 627cals
*Total 111/75/27 976 cals** (approx 45 mins apart)*


*10.30am*
Veggies 4/14/0 70cals
Chicken Breast 50/0/8 264cals
*Total 54/14/8 334 cals*

*12.30pm*
Healthy Burger 37/50/17 495cals
*Total 37/50/17 495cals*

*3.30pm*
Mince meat 43/0/10 258 cals
Sweet Potato 1/13/0 57 cals
Mashed Potato 1/15/0 65cals
*Total 45/28/10 380cals*

*5.30pm*
Workout

*6.30pm*
Shake 65/75/11 627cals
*Total 65/75/11 627cals*

*8.30pm*
Salmon 44/0/24 412cals
Cous Cous 4/20/2 110cals
*Total 48/20/26 522cals*

*10.00pm*
Bed

*Totals for the day:
360/262/99 3333cals*

*Daily %
50/36/14*

These are the appox values I worked out, if I have anything wrong please correct me.

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## Gucks

> Thanks for the input so far guys.
> 
> To answer your question I was at one point 82kg but that was after a big bulking routine (Max-OT) and a CRAZY diet (my pre bedtime meal was 60g protein, 90g oats, 60g maltodextrin, 2 tablespoons of peanut butter, ice cream and full cream milk)... so my bf might have been around 14-15% then I cut weight and cut down to maybe 11-12%bf... but was only around 80kg. So that was essentially my peak. Yes I know it doesn't sound like much of a peak but I was/am, an extreme ectomorph, I started at 60kg and have spent a few years building up my base strength and training and dieting. I feel confident I can get back to around 80kg within the next few weeks and then the test should kick in and hopefully sling shot me up a bit higher.
> 
> You'll notice that my cycle is fairly modest, being only 400mg for 10 weeks, not exactly crazy amounts of gear. I am using the gear to enhance the results I would achieve naturally, not as a crutch to hold up an otherwise poor program.
> 
> I guess my goals are ultimately to be around 85-87kg, but then I just want to be lean. I figure that if I want to be 87kg with say 8% bf... then I need to be around 90kg at 13% before I cut (check my maths). I honestly don't believe I could achieve that naturally, but who knows. I don't really know what to expect with this cycle but what I would really like is to make as much LEAN muscle gains as possible. My plans long term are to run this cycle and make solid gains, keep as much as possible and then maybe next year run test/tren cycle to lean up...
> 
> Ok on to my diet, I will just say quickly to Gucks... I have the steak as soon as I wake up, literally 5 mins to cook and then I eat it, then I have a shower and get ready for work and drink the shake on my way to work. It is the easiest way for me to get early morning carbs and it is more or less straight away... that should be almost perfect right? I get a load of protein and carbs straight up. Then for my next meal I have chicken breast with veggies, this is the most sedentary part of my day (desk job) so I avoid any more carbs. Then at lunch this is my meal with most room for improvement, we all go out for lunch but I always choose something relatively healthy, subway, chicken kebab (low fat, salad, wheat tortilla). In the afternoon before my workout I eat lean mince and sweet potato so this is protein and carbs to fuel my work out. BCAAs through my workout, then a whey protein shake with oats for PWO carbs. Then I eat salmon which has obviously got good fats and protein with cous cous for carbs. Then steak right before bed to give me slow digesting protein through the night. 
> ...


firstly, i wish i could afford 2 eat steak twice a day :P u could replace ur night time steak with casein/cottage cheese for a much leaner choice (and cheaper). those fats r just insane man...seriously need 2 be addressed! protein should come down and carbs should go up to meet in the middle.

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## smashingbox

Bro no offense, but you are 19? 6 foot something and only ~170lbs? Not really comfortable taking your advice ey. Your advice so far has been: 

a) too much protein - your body will not store protein as anything other than muscle... the rest will be burned via a process called gluconeogensis or excreted - so it is safe to say that there is no REAL issue with consuming this amount of protein other than it is surplus to requirements.

b) too much fat? A large portion of my fat comes from salmon and/or avocado (on healthy burger - which is breast fillet chicken, avo and wholemeal roll with salad) which is full of omega 3s and other 'healthy fats' which are extremely important. I agree the steaks seem a little fatty so I have done some research and I cant see them having more than about 16.2g of fat, of which only about a third is saturated.

c) low GI/complex carbs at 10am - if low GI complex carbs are digested across 3-4 hours then my morning meal should cover me well until lunch right? So no need to go adding any at 10am when I am sedentary?

d) swap out the salmon for steak and pills? Did you really think about this? I eat steak twice a day, and salmon is practically a super food... where you thinking when you wrote this?

I will post up amended figures and also drop 9.30pm steak as it is probably overkill. When giving advice keep in mind I am a hard gainer, who is on cycle and thus will have to keep calories quite high, good fats are an excellent source of calories.

I appreciate your input but it just doesn't add up for me I am afraid, if someone else (i.e. a vet or diet guru) can back up your advice then I will happily eat humble pie, it can replace the steak at 9.30pm.

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## Gucks

> Bro no offense, but you are 19? 6 foot something and only ~170lbs? Not really comfortable taking your advice ey. Your advice so far has been: 
> 
> a) too much protein - your body will not store protein as anything other than muscle... the rest will be burned via a process called gluconeogensis or excreted - so it is safe to say that there is no REAL issue with consuming this amount of protein other than it is surplus to requirements.
> *that is such a bullshit myth. protein cant be stored as anything other then muscle? unused protein gets converted to glucose just like carbs. wuld u like to guess what unused glucose it stored as? fat!*
> 
> b) too much fat? A large portion of my fat comes from salmon and/or avocado (on healthy burger - which is breast fillet chicken, avo and wholemeal roll with salad) which is full of omega 3s and other 'healthy fats' which are extremely important. I agree the steaks seem a little fatty so I have done some research and I cant see them having more than about 16.2g of fat, of which only about a third is saturated. *it doesnt matter whether their healthy fats or not, too much fat is too much fat. EFA's have the same amount of calories as saturated fat.*
> 
> c) low GI/complex carbs at 10am - if low GI complex carbs are digested across 3-4 hours then my morning meal should cover me well until lunch right? So no need to go adding any at 10am when I am sedentary? *carbs aren't absorbed linearly. they get absorbed more so when first ingested and then tapper off for 3-4 hours depending on the source of carbs and what they were eatin with. a meal every 3 hours is most peoples target.*
> 
> ...


im 186ibs mate at about 11-12% bf. last june i was 135ibs and anorexic. 51ibs in 50 weeks doesnt sound to bad to me, does it to you?

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## Gucks

http://www.1stholistic.com/Nutrition...urn-to-fat.htm

theres a basic explenation of how protein ends up being stored as fat.

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## smashingbox

Look bro, not interested in arguing with you, gluconeogensis is a very unfavourable pathway for energy and very inefficient... not really worried about getting fat from protein consumption... especially not when you are suggesting carbs instead. Provided my calories are in check overall and provided I am not consuming low GI shitty carbs or non-lean meats, I am not concerned. Thanks again for your input but I will be waiting for more experienced members to contribute.

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## layeazy

Good to see ya on mate 

You should reach those goal weights comfortably 

Good dose good overall cycle...

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## smashingbox

Quick update:
So did my 5th jab on Sunday, just entering into my 3rd week. I have put on a few kg, up to 78kg, so 3kg in 2 weeks... this isn't from the gear though I don't think because I am not really feeling anything yet, and it is too early for the gear to be working. I have been going harder in the gym but I think this is just psychological. Pretty impressed so far, I have been making good gains naturally and have got back to where I wanted to be just in time for the juice to kick in.

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## smashingbox

8th June - 79kg, up 4kg from start in just under 3 weeks, pretty happy with this, strength is up and having some good gym sessions but still nothing exceptional. Did shoulders and triceps today. Really hoping that the gear kicks in soon and I can feel a big difference... really looking forward to what the next 8 weeks brings!

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## bonosmate

steak for breakfast?

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## smashingbox

14 June (mid point of week 4) - weight stayed the same at 79kg although this could be due to terrible choices on the weekend, went out drinking Friday night and didnt eat much the following day. Terrible effort, wont be doing that again. Noticed some slight improvements in workouts, lifts are up but nothing crazy yet. Overall I haven't noticed any increased aggression, sweating, improved mood, increased libido or significant strength gains. I am really looking forward to it so hope to see some signs of improvement by the end of this week.

Took my first HCG shot today, 250ui, started HCG 1 week later so can increase usage during 1 week before PCT. I had experienced some atrophy, testes are about half normal size, so I am interested to see what effect 250ui of HCG twice per week might have.

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## Windex

> 14 June (mid point of week 4) - *weight stayed the same at 79kg although this could be due to terrible choices on the weekend, went out drinking Friday night and didnt eat much the following day*. Terrible effort, wont be doing that again. Noticed some slight improvements in workouts, lifts are up but nothing crazy yet. Overall I haven't noticed any increased aggression, sweating, improved mood, increased libido or significant strength gains. I am really looking forward to it so hope to see some signs of improvement by the end of this week.
> 
> Took my first HCG shot today, 250ui, started HCG 1 week later so can increase usage during 1 week before PCT. I had experienced some atrophy, testes are about half normal size, so I am interested to see what effect 250ui of HCG twice per week might have.


More evidence you are not ready to cycle. BigD's left leg is as big as you. Do you even know what damage alcohol can cause when your on steroids ? *Good thing you weren't on Tren because you could've killed yourself*. No reason to bash Gucks he was giving you great advice. Just because your old enough doesn't mean your ready for steroid use . Your diet has A LOT of room for improvement and you are extremely light. I guarantee you will lose all your weight halfway through or at the end of your PCT because honestly you have no clue what your doing.

Let me guess you want to look like Josef Rackich or those other aesthetic Bodybuilders from Australian right ?

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## Darfus

Ouch, that had to hurt.

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## smashingbox

Thanks for your input bro, not really sure about your whole 'on Tren you could have killed yourself'... there are plenty of blokes on tren here mate and loads of them go out every weekend, give me some stats on tren users dying from drinking whenever you have them handy.

I have improved my diet. I improved it based on Gucks and Gbrice's advice. But if you say my diet has lots of room for improvement, then be specific, what would you change? What are your recommendations? Don't just get on here and bag me if you aren't going to offer anything constructive.

No idea who Josef Rackich is but I'll assume this comment was just you trying to make yourself feel better about not looking like him.

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## smashingbox

Hahahahahahaha @ Windex... bro your avatar is a pic of Josef Rakich, wtf?? 

http://www.simplyshredded.com/josef-...interview.html

I googled him, and yeah about that size/bf would be ideal, but dude if you are giving out to me about 'wanting to look like him' why the **** do you have HIS picture for YOUR avatar??

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## oldschoolfitness

hell i think any of us would be happy to be as lean as that dude(rakich) !!! you look like you're making good progress bro keep it up i think this was a good cycle to start on for ya not to heavy or to light. i'm not even going to talk about diet mine has always need work (just like to eat what i want). i also think you have a good mind set by "enhancing results" you realize that gear is no miracle pill and you just have to keep working on it or off. good luck with the rest of the cycle

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## layeazy

Your arms are looking little bigger mate..

Keep training and gaining...

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## Gucks

josef rakich is a kiwi btw :P one thing they hate is being called australian...

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## smashingbox

They like it about as much as the Irish like being called poms.

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## Gucks

> They like it about as much as the Irish like being called poms.


ive been irish for 19 years and never even heard pom b4 :P wtf is a pom man..?

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## smashingbox

A pom is what Aussies and presumably others call people from England.

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## Choppers

Prisoner of the Motherland.... British convicts sent out to Australia in late 1700's I believe. It's still used all the time over here even today!

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## mrnice2011

good look with your cycle.keep us updated!

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## TopDogg

good luck,
any chance you can post some before and now pictures?

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## Str8Jakked

> josef rakich is a kiwi btw :P one thing they hate is being called australian...


Lol, I think I would rather be called an ''Australian" than a fruit.  :Big Grin:

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## smashingbox

21st June (mid way through 5th week): well I have plateaued out at 80kg, dont seem to be going any higher. Still not feeling anything, no insane pumps or workouts (workouts have been intense and have been pushing myself... but nothing outrageous), no increase in libido, no overall feeling of wellbeing, no increased aggression, no rapid increase in strength, no nothing... the only thing I have noticed is that my balls have shrunk a bit. So still I wait. I know my gear is legit, 100%, so just wondering what is going on... the only thing I could think of is my last two shots were in the glutes and only used 1 1/4 inch pins... so maybe didnt make it to the muscle?? I doubt this is the case because I have very little fat and it felt like an intramuscular injection.

Anyway, it is the 5th week... so hopefully at the latest I should be feeling something by next week?

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## Bigd89

22g 1 1/4 inch is what Im using for my glutes. Im in week 7 running 500mgs test e, and kick start with 40mgs dbol the first four weeks. Haven't lost any weight or strength since I dropped the dbol. I've gained 5lbs since then, and my strength is still climbing.

I think your being paranoid about the pin shot not reaching the muscle.

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## Bigd89

Btw, if your libido has not increased by now your gear might be fake. Since week 3 I've been tearing my wife up...sometimes 3 times a day. She actually doesn't want sex anymore LOL.

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## brad1986

> Btw, if your libido has not increased by now your gear might be fake. Since week 3 I've been tearing my wife up...sometimes 3 times a day. She actually doesn't want sex anymore LOL.


I know i love that part of cycleing.... but when the cycle is over my wife starts bugging me as to why im not "all over her anymore" haha good thing shes cool with my gear use and understands how it works

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## brad1986

> 22g 1 1/4 inch is what Im using for my glutes. Im in week 7 running 500mgs test e, and kick start with 40mgs dbol the first four weeks. Haven't lost any weight or strength since I dropped the dbol. I've gained 5lbs since then, and my strength is still climbing.
> 
> I think your being paranoid about the pin shot not reaching the muscle.


Hey im def seeing a difference in your body btw! Your avi pic lookds alot leaner then the last pic i saw of you

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## auslifta

> josef rakich is a kiwi btw :P one thing they hate is being called australian...


WTF you talking about???? Its an honor for them. You watch too many tarantino movies  :Smilie:

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## auslifta

I'll be keeping an eye on this one. Goodluck!

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## PurpleOnes

In my opinnion you could achieve better base as natural ,before starting cycle, but I guess it your choise.

Anyways I will be following this thread , to see how you will change  :Wink:

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## smashingbox

I know my gear isn't fake, and I have some testicular atrophy... Like they are half normal size. How much are you on? I am thinking that maybe the gear is under dosed. My libido isnaturally quite high but if anything it has dropped off, although I have been a little depressed lately so maybe this is related? I honestly don't know I just want to see/feel some results!

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## Bigd89

250 twice a week-500mgs a week.

Your source local? Or online?

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## auslifta

I think maybe your estro levels are getting high, do you have aromasin ?

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## smashingbox

Bro I am in Australian, trying to get anything online through our customs is near impossible... so my source is local.

Why do you say my estro levels are high? Wouldn't I still be noticing increased strength and/or other test related improvements? If my estro levels are too high wouldn't I be carrying extra water, etc?

I have some arimidex on hand, was thinking about taking a small amount?

I am switching this week to Test-E 500mg/wk and see how that goes.

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## lovbyts

No not necessarily. Lower libido is a good sign that your E2 is high. You may still see good or OK gains for a while. I was reading something that sounds interesting and in your case you should try since you cant easily get an AI right now. Keep your dose the same, dont go higher or your E2 will get worse. Split your injections up into EOD or even daily. Yeah it can be a pain but you can use the 25g, 27g or even 29g slin pins 1/2 and it's supposed to keep your levels from spiking and keep the estrogen down.

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## auslifta

> No not necessarily. *Lower libido is a good sign that your E2 is high*. You may still see good or OK gains for a while. I was reading something that sounds interesting and in your case you should try since you cant easily get an AI right now. Keep your dose the same, dont go higher or your E2 will get worse. Split your injections up into EOD or even daily. Yeah it can be a pain but you can use the 25g, 27g or even 29g slin pins 1/2 and it's supposed to keep your levels from spiking and keep the estrogen down.


This is why I think your estro levels are high. Maybe start this and see how you go if it gets worse. Aromasin might be better if you can get it.

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## smashingbox

Well I might have spoken too soon, last Thursday seemed like the flicking of a switch... overall mood has improved, confidence increased, etc. In the gym I have noticed increased sweating, a strange sensation of my head getting hot randomly, slightly increased vascularity. Still not seeing any crazy strength gains, but this will hopefully follow soon.

My weight is up slightly to 80.5kg. I will post a progress pic soon, not much change.

I am still considering taking some arimidex at .25mg EOD or E3D just to try and keep bloat away... but not sure if this is wise. How can you distinguish between water retention and body fat?

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## smashingbox

Oh and libido is back and hard ons are so fkn hard they hurt sometimes.

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## auslifta

Good news, glad your feeling it. Generally with bloating you will get a puffy face and even spread, where as fat would gather lower back, stomach first. Keep an eye on your ankles and wrists, they will tell you weather is is water or not. ankles dont usually gain much fat unless you put on alot.

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## smashingbox

Ok well today marks first shot of week 7. I have switched now to Test-E 250mg/ml @ 500mg/week. I made the decision to switch a week or so ago when I wasn't feeling anything however things have changed. I did my first delt shot and it made aspirating impossible! Overall though it was painless and easy so might continue to hit delts.

I am now up to 81kg, and definitely feeling better all around, just an overall feeling of wellbeing. I was worried about 'roid rage ' however it seems like so far the opposite has occured, I am more 'happy-go-lucky' and as previously stated generally just feeling good. Today's gym session was really good, hit some PBs and maintained a really good intensity.

The HCG at 250ui doesn't seem to be enough to keep my balls from atrohpying, they tend to balloon a little up and down, up a little after HCG shot and then down again before the next one... if I had some more HCG I would increase to 250ui 3 times per week or even 500ui twice a week... but dont want to run out before PCT.

Libido is not sky high as I would expect, it is kinda down if anything, but I have no other signs of high estro so really not sure what I should do here... whether it is worth trying arimidex @ 0.25mg EOD or even E3D and risk losing potential gains? Or whether to just keep going as is? Any thoughts?

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## auslifta

I think continue until you notice any signs to start.

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## FlyingNun

any updates?

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## pointblank

updates bro?

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## smashingbox

Well I have plenty of updating to do, unfortunately cycle was cut short slightly by some unrelated medical issue. I have been offline for a while because my computer shat itself. Computer is fixed so I will upload final pics and give full update soon. I reached 83kg with no appreciable increase in body fat, that is a total gain of 8kg or about 17.5lbs. I have so far maintained it (2 weeks since last shot) and will look to lean out a little with clen during PCT.

RIP to Aussie Zyzz, although he had his critics the man was always fairly pleasent and accomplished a lot with his physique. He died too young and in unfortunate circumstances.

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## smashingbox

So just to update, cycle went well overall with a couple of small interuptions, at one point I became concerned about possible high estro, my nipples were getting itchy and being paranoid about gyno I took 0.25mg of arimidex ... holy shit it ****ed me for almost a weak, sore joints, low energy, poor mood, etc. 

I cut my cycle short 2 weeks ago because I had been getting intense headaches when working out, twice I had to leave the gym after 1 working set and then had a headache for the remainder of the night and into the next day. I saw a doctor and told him about everything, he said as much as he wanted to tell me to stop taking steroids he didn't think it was linked at all. As a precaution I stopped taking gear anyway, got an MRI scan to ensure I didn't have any bleeding in my brain etc. MRI came back all good so still looking for an answer on what is causing them, in the mean time I have been working out at about 80% capacity and avoiding certain exercises which seem to make the headaches worse.

As I mentioned above I am sitting on around 83kg, or 183lbs, an overall gain of 8kg or 17.5lbs. Not a bad effort but I had hoped for a bit more.

I had planned to run HCG throughout my cycle but abadoned this because I didnt like the idea of peppering my balls with small signals to turn on and countered by the natural signals to shut down, so I just skipped this altogether and instead will run 500ui/day for the next 5 days before starting PCT. I will also start clen during PCT, and also DAA and creatine to try and retain gains.

Here are some final pics, nothing insane, nothing overwhelming, but some solid gains.

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## canadianbrah

Looking good op, shame about having to cut the cycle early....wonder why u were getting those bad headaches.

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## cam89

Not a smart idea on skipping the HCG . You will lose more of the gains because you skipped it.

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