# MEMBERS EXPERIENCES > MEMBER'S CYCLE RESULTS >  notorious's first cycle

## xnotoriousx

Week Testosterone E_____Dianabol
1	500 mg / per week_____40 mg / per day
2	500 mg / per week_____40 mg / per day
3	500 mg / per week_____40 mg / per day
4	500 mg / per week_____40 mg / per day
5	500 mg / per week_____40 mg / per day	
6	500 mg / per week_____40 mg / per day	
7	500 mg / per week	
8	500 mg / per week	
9	500 mg / per week	
10	500 mg / per week	
11	500 mg / per week	
12	500 mg / per week

2 weeks after last one start pct
Clomid 50/50/50/50
Nolva 40/20/20/20
armidex on hand just incase


Wake up:

2 Scoops whey
45mins-1hour low intensity cardio each day. Might goto eod

MEAL #1 

8 Egg Whites
3 Whole Eggs
1cup oats 



MEAL #2 

10oz chicken
1cup Brown Rice
fish oil

MEAL #3 PWO

10oz Chicken
1cup white rice
1cup broccoli



MEAL #4 

10oz Chicken
3 Red potatoes 
1cup broccoli




MEAL #5 

Lean Ground Beef 93%
3 Red potatoes 
Fishoil



MEAL #6 

1.5cups CC 
1tbsp Nat PB


Mid morning piss 
2 scoops whey

Around 4,100 cals

I'll be playing with the diet as I go, i'm starting with this, and will adjust it as needed. Most likely i'll be adding in more pro/fat as I go, Right now i'm trying to keep it very clean and lean.



*Starting Stats
6'3
202lbs
11-12% BF*







*WISH ME LUCK!*

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## redz

Sounds like you are well prepared, good luck!

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## Carpe

Same cycle as me...similar stats aswell. I'll be following :Smilie:

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## xnotoriousx

Almost forgot wheelz



*Here we go!!!*

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## 92whitelx

nice bro, you will love the gains your gonna get

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## xnotoriousx

Weight; 202lbs 


Shoulder workout went good. Of course no effects of anything yet.
5x5 sets military press
3 sets upright rows
3 sets db front raises
3 sets behind back bb shrugs

Next shoulder workout, i'll add in more rear deltoid work.





So i'm splitting the dbol up throughout the day ever 4 hours i'll take 10mg. I'm going to go grab some milk thistle today since i've heard you should take it. How much of it should be taken?

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## Batman360

You have good base to start, very lean too. Good idea to split the dbol so it doesn't stress the liver and so it distributes evenly through the day. I'll be watching this thread to see how you progress. Looks like we started cycles on the same day too. Good luck!

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## xnotoriousx

Ok, I bought the milk thistle. I've been trying to read up on exactly how much and how often I should take this stuff and keep coming up with different shit, so for now i'm just taking 200mg with each 10mg of dbol and will be trying to take in 2 gallons of water each day.

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## gymguy30

Good luck bro! Everything looks good, sounds like your water intake is spot on. Drink Drink! You should be feeling some good pumps very soon with the dbol .

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## F4iGuy

Looking forward to updates

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## xnotoriousx

I told myself I was going to be a bad ass about it, but when it came down to the wire I was nearly shaking... Literally.

Lucky for me, I had a good friend to help me out, i'm going to have to really suck it up so i'll be able to do it on my on. 

All in all, it was painless. He even used the same pin to draw and pin no pain at all.

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## Juturna

Keep us posted - I'll be checking the log when I can. Good luck.

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## stpete

You'll get used to the injections and actually start looking forward to them. Good luck man.

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## Aizen Sosuke

You look good brother. Keep us updated

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## xnotoriousx

Starting weight; 202
Now:202.6

*Workout - Back and Triceps* 

Dead lifts 5x5
Wide pull ups 3 sets
Close grip seated rows 3 sets
T-bar rows 3 sets

Skull crushers 3 sets
Dumbbell extensions 3 sets
dips 3 sets
------------------------------------------------------------------


I woke up this morning to go brush my teeth, I always clear my sinuses and when I did a bunch of blood was in my spit. Then I noticed my nose had been bleeding throughout the night. Kinda freaked me the hell out because i've never had a nose bleed before. I can't imagine it was from just 1 day of 40mg of the dbol but you never know. Hopefully it doesn't happen again, i'd hate to have to stop my cycle over it. Today at the gym was pretty good, nothing crazy just another day, however pump was a little fuller then normal... Hoping the dbol kicks in good over the next few days.

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## Carpe

You should feel some pump and vascularity soon from the dbol . But for strength it didn't kick until 8-9 days in.

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## xnotoriousx

So far the only things I've noticed are a bit larger of an appetite, and my mood has been good about all day. Not sure if i'm just having a good day or if it's the blue hearts.

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## thai-lan

wow you are 202?? how tall are you?

just saw it ur 6'3

im not trying to be an ass but i think your bodyfat is higher than %11

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## ranging1

hey mate, good luck with ur cycle, I REALLY HOPE IT GOES GREAT FOR U

BUT i have to agree with above comment, id say ur 13-14%bf atleast

just becuase im 13.5% and look leaner then u,
dw not trying to critisze, just helping u out with stats, the more accurate they are the better ulll know ur body

BTW uve got a pretty good base naturally so u should go great on this cycle

JUST MAKE SURE U EAT!!!!!!! lol

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## thai-lan

> hey mate, good luck with ur cycle, I REALLY HOPE IT GOES GREAT FOR U
> 
> BUT i have to agree with above comment, id say ur 13-14%bf atleast
> 
> just becuase im 13.5% and look leaner then u,
> dw not trying to critisze, just helping u out with stats, the more accurate they are the better ulll know ur body
> 
> BTW uve got a pretty good base naturally so u should go great on this cycle
> 
> JUST MAKE SURE U EAT!!!!!!! lol


he right , if u know your stats its easier to improve them.. and i know xnotoriousx , and ve seen him around forum for long time , i think he knows what he's doing

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## xnotoriousx

I'd almost be willing to bet i'm not over 12% but you never know. Haven't had it checked in 2 months and it was 10.2 then. I've been bulking alot harder since then so hell it might be over 12. It would be a good idea to go get that done asap but I need to find someone to do it.

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## xnotoriousx

weight will be measured every 7 days.

No bloody nose today. It's embarrassing to admit this but I think what actually happened was I hit myself in the nose night before last because today my nose was sore as hell when I moved it. So it's embarrassing as hell but it's good because I know it wasn't the dbol that caused it... Phew!


Only cardio today so I went for a hour long jog. At first I felt like my heart was beating abnormally fast for the very light jog I was maintaining then after about 15 minutes I felt like a machine. I really hope i'm going to respond to this cycle good... Time will tell.

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## xnotoriousx

Also here's a look at me right around the first on the year. 

I've done my homework, learned my body and have more dedication at this point then I've ever had towards anything in my life.

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## Juturna

After WK1 is over you could always bump Dbol to 50mg's.

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## xnotoriousx

*Legs*
Squats 5x5
Stiff deads 10,8,8
Leg extensions 12,10,10,8 
Leg curls 10,10,8

Legs were toasted after the workout.


Felt great all day, diet was spot on had one cheat meal all week (5-6 slices of thin crust pizza)




*Day 5*



*Chest*
Incline db press 12,10,8,7
Flat bb press 12-10-8 did rest pause on these
Incline db flies 12-10-8
Weighted Dips 12-10-8
Seated machine flies 1 pump set

Noticed a very nice boost in power today along with a insane chest pump. I think the dbols are starting to kick in pretty good.

----------


## xnotoriousx

Here's what the arms are looking like right now... I've been bulking HARD lol so i'm adding some bodyfat but i'm hoping to have it taken care of soon as i'm just starting eod cardio and might even ramp it up to every day for a couple weeks to get lean because my over all goal is not to just bulk on as much as I can, but rather gain lean muscle while dropping bf and being big and lean at the 12th week. Hope I get this right...

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## Epic1

looking alot thicker bro. Keep it up!

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## xnotoriousx

Did my second pin today it went a lot better then the last time, I think i'm done with the jitters from pinning.


I'm really at a crossroads with my workout schedule also i've been doing chest/bi and back/tri workouts and i'm ready to change it up. My buddy just turned me on to a MMA class that will be on Mondays and Wednesdays so my schedule looks like this.


Sunday-Legs
Monday-Chest AM Cardio low intensity tredmill 1hr then at night 1.5 hours mma class
Tuesday-Arms
Wednesday-OFF AM Cardio low intensity tredmill 1hr then at night 2 hours mma class
Thursday-Back AM Cardio low intensity tredmill 1hr
Friday-Shoulders
Saturday-OFF AM Cardio low intensity tredmill 1hr

Any opinions on this?

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## Skippa

> Sunday-Legs
> Monday-Chest AM Cardio low intensity tredmill 1hr then at night 1.5 hours mma class
> Tuesday-Arms
> Wednesday-OFF AM Cardio low intensity tredmill 1hr then at night 2 hours mma class
> Thursday-Back AM Cardio low intensity tredmill 1hr
> Friday-Shoulders
> Saturday-OFF AM Cardio low intensity tredmill 1hr
> 
> Any opinions on this?


Nice!

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## Carpe

My opinion? That much cardio will most likely hamper growth, but if you are trying to lean out just keep diet thight, especially around high intensity cardio like mma

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## xnotoriousx

You really think it will slow growth? I always get 8 hours of sleep. Everything is done at low intensity for 1 hour other then the mma training 2x a week which so far is pretty intense but done like interval cardio.

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## Carpe

I think so, yes. I can't see why you do 60 mins of steady state cardio.

30 minutes on off days, or 3x per week is good for recovery and circulation, appetite and helping you to stay lean while consuming a lot of calories. But much more than that is not good for growth. I'm not saying you'll lose muscle, you just probably won't maximize muscle gains.

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## xnotoriousx

Approaching my first week mark I've got to say i'm pretty happy with the decision to start. Though I haven't made any noticeable gains yet other then looking a bit fuller, i'm noticing a increase in power and i'm loving it.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



*Workout - Arms*
Standing BB Curls 2 sets to failure (21s)
Incline DB Curls 10,10,8
Preacher Curls 10,10,8
Chin Ups 1xfailure

Skull Crushers 12,10,8
Rope Pulldowns 10,10,8
Dips Weighted, 10,8,6



A much needed rest day coming up tomorrow, i'll step on the scale and see what i've gained in one week then.

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## BIGJOL

Good Luck Bro! ill be watching...

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## PC650

damn your lookin swole bro!

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## Ronnie Rowland

> Week Testosterone E_____Dianabol
> 1	500 mg / per week_____40 mg / per day
> 2	500 mg / per week_____40 mg / per day
> 3	500 mg / per week_____40 mg / per day
> 4	500 mg / per week_____40 mg / per day
> 5	500 mg / per week	
> 6	500 mg / per week	
> 7	500 mg / per week	
> 8	500 mg / per week	
> ...




Here's my suggestion-

Do an 8 week anabolic cycle as opposed to a 12 week cycle. Most anabolics quit working after an 8 week period. During this 8 week period I would run both the d-bol and test for 8 weeks straight. I would also reload with higher volume (8-12 intense work sets per body part once a week) throughout the whole 8 week cycle. This means reload for 8 weeks straight! 

After the 8 week reload I would do pct for 2 weeks or bridge with only 250 mgs of test per week. This is your two week deload where you cut training volume in half and reduce protein intake in half. That means only 4-6 intense work sets per body part once a week. After the 2 week deload go back to another 4-8 week anabolic steroid cycle/reload. This type of progression is what makes you bigger as opposed to staying on anabolics for 12 weeks and then going off 12 weeks (yo-yo). 

I would drop the 3 potatoes in meal five and add for more healthy fats that meal to help keep you leaner!

Drop cardio to 3 days per week...

use milk thistle during pct only not while on d-bol or test...

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## xnotoriousx

> Here's my suggestion-
> 
> Do an 8 week anabolic cycle as opposed to a 12 week cycle. Most anabolics quit working after an 8 week period. During this 8 week period I would run both the d-bol and test for 8 weeks straight. I would also reload with higher volume (8-12 intense work sets per body part once a week) throughout the whole 8 week cycle. This means reload for 8 weeks straight! 
> 
> After the 8 week reload I would do pct for 2 weeks or bridge with only 250 mgs of test per week. This is your two week deload where you cut training volume in half and reduce protein intake in half. That means only 4-6 intense work sets per body part once a week. After the 2 week deload go back to another 4-8 week anabolic steroid cycle/reload. This type of progression is what makes you bigger as opposed to staying on anabolics for 12 weeks and then going off 12 weeks (yo-yo). 
> 
> I would drop the 3 potatoes in meal five and add for more healthy fats that meal to help keep you leaner!
> 
> Drop cardio to 3 days per week...
> ...


Thanks for the advice Ronnie, much appreciated.

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## xnotoriousx

Starting weight; 202
Now:207(+5lbs)

*Rest Day MMA Class tonight for cardio*
---------------------------------------------------------------------------

It looks like 5lbs is what I've gained in 7 days. It's funny seeing the scale at 207, I remember dreaming about hitting 190  :Smilie:

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## Carpe

I wouldn't be surprised if you weighed in at 215-217 next week bro. :Smilie:

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## xnotoriousx

> I wouldn't be surprised if you weighed in at 215-217 next week bro.


Don't get my hopes up  :Wink/Grin:  :Wink/Grin:

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## xnotoriousx

*SHIT!!!*

I just got the call to go back to work today, I start tomorrow. This isn't necessarily a bad thing, it just throws everything I had planned for a loop. I do outside Line work construction so i'll be working out of a truck all day... Everything is going to have to change, and I only have one day to prepare for it.

Ok, so if I get up early enough, i'll have my eggs/oats meal, then i'll pack 3 chicken/rice meals then get home, workout, pwo have a shake then 1 hour later have the Lean beef and potatoes meal, then finish the day with some CC and PB and that's it. The diet won't be as clean as before, there's just no way to nail it perfect while working 12 hour days so everything won't be PERFECT like I planned with the diet ect but i'm still going to continue my cycle and nail the diet the best I can... It's going to take a lot more will power now.

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## Aizen Sosuke

You can do it man. I used to work in contruction 10hrs a day and still manage to eat clean.

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## xnotoriousx

Now i'm getting a little chest cold or something, feel like plain shit.. A little fever... I've noticed quite a few of these during peoples logs, I wonder if it's juice related. Feel like ass.. "when it rains, it pours" right?

I'll push through all of this... I won't let work, or whatever the hell this shit is i'm catching bring me down, I've come to far to **** up now.

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## xnotoriousx

Feeling ALOT better. Drank a ton of water and took a lot of vitamin c and ate 1.5 cups of cottage cheese every 4 hours... It was a rough ass day but I made it and here I stand on day 9
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

*Workout - Shoulder/Calves*
Military press 10,8,8
Seated DB press 12,10,6
Side db raise 12,10,8
Rear delt db raise 10,10,8
DB shrugs 12,10,8

Seated calf 15,12,10
Standing calf 15,12,10

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## green182

Lookin Swol! Keep it up man. I know a lot of people might disagree with me on this but while on this strict diet, dont forget to feed that ego of yours... Your fixing to get MASSIVE. I will be monitoring your progress. I am considering a cycle identical to yours in the next couple of months, so I am very interested. Are you planning a second cycle?

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## xnotoriousx

> Lookin Swol! Keep it up man. I know a lot of people might disagree with me on this but while on this strict diet, dont forget to feed that ego of yours... Your fixing to get MASSIVE. I will be monitoring your progress. I am considering a cycle identical to yours in the next couple of months, so I am very interested. Are you planning a second cycle?


Hey man thanks for the complements I appreciate it. 

I haven't planned a second cycle, and don't think I will as of now. Told myself going into this that I would only do it for the plateau breaker and to experience it for myself since I felt I was ready to do so... You never know what the future brings though, so far I don't enjoy the pinning and have had a few sides I don't enjoy to much but I am loving the good mood feeling, power, sex drive and size gains i'm getting and the test hasn't even kicked in!

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## Carpe

What kind of sides are you experiencing from the dbol ? I haven't gotten any sides at all, other than 20 lb gain in 3 weeks lol

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## green182

Yea, i didnt experience any sides with dbol either...

what sides do you have?

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## xnotoriousx

Woke up in a puddle of sweat a couple nights and a couple pimples on chest and shoulders but not bad though. Nothing major.

Hit my back today and noticed a big increase on my wide grip hanging pull ups I gained 5 reps on those and gained 3 reps on my final set of dead lifts to (315x8)... Strength is going up fast.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Workout - Back
Hanging wide pull-ups 12,10,9
Dead Lift 12,10,8
1 Arm DB Rows 12,10,8
T-Bar Rows 12,10,8

Did some ab work and got out of there. Workout was great noticed a much bigger pump, lower back pump was a bit much but not a WHOLE lot more then normal. I'm loving what i'm seeing though fellas, i'll have to take some shots in 2 weeks after the dbol is done. 

My girlfriend said to me the earlier today "It seems like ever time I see you, you look bigger" LOL

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## xnotoriousx

Power is up! Weight is moving slow but i'm noticing everything looks bigger, no bloat, doesn't look like i'm holding much water at all, standing at 208lbs. 

Today was the first day I can say I actually noticed the dbol "kick in" All I can say is today was my best workout ever, I felt like a complete animal. I was SO much stronger then normal.. I'll be honest I was a little disappointed the dbol until today, now I can't wait to see what happens in these next 2 weeks. I'm now a believer, dbol is the real deal.


Starting weight; 202
Now:208(+6)

*Workout - Chest* 
Incline BB Press 12,10,8
Flat BB Press 12,10,8
Incline DB Flys 10,10,8
Weighted Dips 12,10,7
Seated Fly Machine 12,12,10






I got out of there because my head was telling me to, but my body wanted to keep banging out sets, it was a good one.

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## Yashp

Hehe, sounds like you're still in for a ride. I'm currently planning the same cycle, though with different doses. When you're doing sets, are you then using the same weight?
E.g.:

Dips 12, 10, 7. Same weight? 

Hoping all the best for you, seems a bit harsh that they call you back right when you're on haha. Btw, two questions:

- have you had any acne before taking gear? I'm acne "prone" in the face, so Im trying to gather as much knowledge on this field.
- how's the nosebleeding? Still having it?

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## xnotoriousx

Answers in *BOLD*




> Hehe, sounds like you're still in for a ride. I'm currently planning the same cycle, though with different doses. When you're doing sets, are you then using the same weight?
> E.g.:
> 
> 12, 10, 7. Same weight? *No, I always do 1 light, 1 medium and then one heavy to failure set. Ended my bench with 225 for 8 reps after inclines yesterday which was a new record for me.
> *
> Hoping all the best for you, seems a bit harsh that they call you back right when you're on haha. *Yeah dude, it is destroying my diet working these 12 hour days, all the guys I work with eat mcdonalds every day it's killing me.*
> 
> - have you had any acne before taking gear? I'm acne "prone" in the face, so Im trying to gather as much knowledge on this field.
> - how's the nosebleeding? Still having it? I've only had 4 pimples so far that have been bad, 2 on my front delt and 2 in the middle of my chest, they suck but it hasn't been that bad
> ...

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## xnotoriousx

Starting weight; 202
Now:210(+8)

*Workout - Biceps and Triceps* 
BB Curls 12,10,9
One Arm DB Preacher Curls 10,10,8
Standing DB Curls 12,10,10

Skull Crushers 12,10,10
Close Grip 10,10,8
Rope Pull Down 12,10,8
------------------------------------------------------------------
The workouts are getting pretty damn intense, I felt like my arms were going to rip out of my skin today. All my shirts are getting tight on me and i'm getting a lot of complements from people around me, it can't be long until they catch on. I'll never admit it!!!

If I can give anyone advice that is planning on running dbol for the first time, it's this. Never let your water intake slip, I messed up yesterday and didn't drink enough water and boom, lower back pump was so intense throughout the day it's not even funny.

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## xnotoriousx

Took a shot just see if there's any visible change after 2 weeks.. What do you think?? Looks like i'm holding more water then I thought. Up to 211 that's 9lbs in 2 weeks.


*1st pic Before starting Cycl*e *2nd pic 2 Weeks into Cycle*

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## manwitplans

Looks like you are holding a bit more water, yes. 
But that just makes you look fuller when you don't have excess bodyfat!

I'll be following this and seeing what is gonna happen with this cycle  :Smilie:

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## green182

Get Swoll brotha man,

I bet your fillin out the shirts man... When I was on DBOL and did Bi's it felt like my arms were gonna rip from the pump. Sound familiar?

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## xnotoriousx

> Get Swoll brotha man,
> 
> I bet your fillin out the shirts man... When I was on DBOL and did Bi's it felt like my arms were gonna rip from the pump. Sound familiar?


Hell yeah, no exaggeration either. 


Getting strong as a ox... Rest day today, doing some heavy deads tomorrow, i'm expecting to put up some new numbers.

Right nipple is a little sore, hope it's nothing to worry about.

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## ranging1

not bad pics, ur definetaly holding fair bit of water, dw im carrying twice asmuch

consider urself lucky lol

plus helps make u look bigger

keep it up  :Smilie:

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## energizer bunny

good progress mate.....

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## xnotoriousx

What's up fellas? Just a little update...


I come in my room the other night and my girl has this weird ass face on and I knew something was up, next thing I know she hits me with the "is there something you want to tell me?" line.

She found my pins!!!

My heart dropped but after a long time of explaining the risks and chances involved of use of AS she was ok with it but still didn't like it. Family issues led me to miss the past 2 days in the gym, my diet to go all out of whack and yesterday I misssed a entire day of dbol so there's been a lot of shit causing my deit and training to be weak as hell lately but I won't let it stop me from getting back on the horse. It kills me because I wanted to make sure everything was perfect when I started but real life situations have made a few day during my early cycle not so perfect but it's all good. I'm still strong and feeling good and i'm moving forward from here. My weight is still at 211lbs so we'll see what happens

----------


## xnotoriousx

Starting weight; 202
Now:211(+9)

*Workout - Back and Triceps* 
Deads 12,8,8 
Wide Pullups 10,10,8
Bent Rows 10,10,8
Seated Close Grip Rows 12,10,8
Dips
Skull Crushers
Rope
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Just did my 6th pin. Hit my quad for the second time, they seem to be so much better then the glute shots, much less soreness thus far. Looking forward to seeing how I react to the test when it kicks in. The dbol is pretty nice, hoping the test is just as good.

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## PC650

quad shots too me are the worst, i love the glutes alot easier

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## xnotoriousx

Check out this back pic from march of this year lol

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## xnotoriousx

+20lbs  *from then to now and just started my cycle... You think i'm being reasonable to expect to be around 215 lean (9-10% BF) at the end of my PCT?*

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## Aizen Sosuke

> +20lbs  *from then to now and just started my cycle... You think i'm being reasonable to expect to be around 215 lean (9-10% BF) at the end of my PCT?*


I dont see why not, would need some front shots to better estimate your bodyfat though.

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## xnotoriousx

.....

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## xnotoriousx

Here's a couple more from today, I feel so much bigger but it's not really showing up to me in the pics, maybe it's just the way this stuff makes you feel. I'm only 3 weeks in so I still got a ways to go... I think the past few days messing up my diet hurt me a little but i'm back at it strong did perfect all day today so i'll just need to keep it repetitive.

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## Narkissos

> Here's my suggestion-
> 
> Do an 8 week anabolic cycle as opposed to a 12 week cycle. Most anabolics quit working after an 8 week period. During this 8 week period I would run both the d-bol and test for 8 weeks straight. I would also reload with higher volume (8-12 intense work sets per body part once a week) throughout the whole 8 week cycle. This means reload for 8 weeks straight! 
> 
> After the 8 week reload I would do pct for 2 weeks or bridge with only 250 mgs of test per week. This is your two week deload where you cut training volume in half and reduce protein intake in half. That means only 4-6 intense work sets per body part once a week. After the 2 week deload go back to another 4-8 week anabolic steroid cycle/reload. This type of progression is what makes you bigger as opposed to staying on anabolics for 12 weeks and then going off 12 weeks (yo-yo). 
> 
> I would drop the 3 potatoes in meal five and add for more healthy fats that meal to help keep you leaner!
> 
> Drop cardio to 3 days per week...
> ...


Solid advice.

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## xnotoriousx

Yeah I think i'm going to take it and only run this one for 8 weeks, I've been told almost the exact same advice from a big guy at my gym so I took it as a sign  :Smilie: 

Think i'm going to cut the dbol off after 5 weeks though

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## xnotoriousx

Starting weight; 202
Now:213

*Workout - Cardio&Abs* 

Circuit Workout for ABS 
------------------------------------------------------------------
I'm not up as much weight as I thought i'd be after seeing all these guys that blow up 20lbs in the first 3 weeks but o well, can't say i'm disappointed because I never thought i'd see the day my scale said 210+

I've thought about adding in cals to my diet but don't think I should because i'm already experiencing some fat gain so I don't want to goto the extreme, my overall goal is to be lean at the end of this thing so i'm not wanting to go to far over maintenance...

Also these past few days of slipping on my diet probably....well definitely hurt my gains over the past couple days but i'm back at it and waiting on that test to kick in should be around 1-2 more weeks really looking forward to it  :Smilie:

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## xnotoriousx

I'm going to be adding Grape Fruit Extract to my diet 10 drop 3x a day. Been reading a lot about how it can really help out the dbol so i'm going to give it a shot since I've only got 2 weeks left on it


*Here's the article if anyone is interested* 





Name: Grapefruit 

Scientific Name: Citrus paradisi 

Grapefruit is believed to be native to Jamaica. Grapefruit trees were planted in Florida in the early 19th century. The United States is the largest producer of grapefruit in the world.

PROPERTIES
High in vitamin C and potassium.
A good source of folate, iron, calcium, and other minerals. 
Pink and red varieties are high in beta carotene, a precursor of vitamin A. 
High in fiber, low in calories. 


PECTIN 
Grapefruit contains pectin (found in the pulp/rind), a form of soluble fibre that can bind to cholesterol. 
In a 16-week double-blind, crossover (placebo or pectin) study using 27 human volunteers screened to be at medium to high risk for coronary heart disease due to hypercholesterolemia, grapefruit pectin supplementation decreased plasma cholesterol by 7.6% and low-density lipoprotein cholesterol by 10.8%. The study did not interfere with the subjects' current diet or lifestyle. (1)

In animal studies, grapefruit pectin inhibited the formation of atherosclerosis. Animals fed a high fat diet plus grapefruit pectin had 24% narrowing of their arteries, while animals fed only the high fat diet had 45% narrowing. (2)


LYCOPENE
Lycopene is a powerful antioxidant, it is the pigment found in fruits and vegetables, providing the colour of tomatoes (which are the best source of lycopene), water melon and pink/red grapefruit. 

There is some evidence that a diet high in lycopene may reduce the risk of prostate cancer, according to the first epidemiological study on this, conducted at Harvard University, 

Men who ate a diet rich in tomato sauce, ketchup or other tomato-based products containing the powerful antioxidant known as lycopene were up to one third less likely to develop the disease. (3)

Although there are no double-blind studies on lycopene at present, the results of observational studies are promising and further research is needed.


GRAPEFRUIT JUICE DRUG INTERACTIONS
This food-drug interaction was actually discovered by accident. A study that was intending to test the interaction of alcohol and a blood pressure medication, used a mixture of alcohol with grapefruit juice to disguise the taste of alcohol for the study. Ironically, alcohol had no effect on the tested medication, but the grapefruit juice seemed to enhance the absorption of the drug. (4)

The researchers then confirmed the finding by comparing drug levels when taken with either grapefruit juice or water and found five-fold higher blood levels of the drug when it was taken with juice. Orange juice did not show this effect. 

Grapefruit juice inhibits a special enzyme (CYP3A4) in the intestines that is responsible for the natural breakdown and absorption of many medications. When the action of this enzyme is blocked, the blood levels of these medications increase, which can lead potentially toxic side effects from the medications.

Research has suggested that flavonoids and/or furanocoumarin present in Grapefruit are the substances that act to block the enzyme in the intestines that normally metabolizes many drugs.

Some medications that interact with grapefruit juice: (5)

Statins (Cholesterol Lowering Drugs) 
Antihistamines: Terfenadine
Calcium Channel Blockers (Blood Pressure Drugs): 
Anti-convulsant: Tegretol (Carbamazepine)
Anxiolytics: Valium (Diazepam)
Anti-depressant: Sertraline Clomipramine
Cortico-steroids : Methylprednisolone
Oestrogens: Ethinyl estradiol
*Anabolic Steroids: Dianabol*
Impotence Drug: Viagra

Although some drugs are given with others to enhance their effects, grapefruit juice should not be used for this purpose because its impact can be unpredictable and potentially dangerous.

The above list is by no means exhaustive. Please consult with your doctor or pharmacist regarding possible interactions between grapefruit juice and medications you may currently be taking if you consume grapefruit/ juice regularly..


THE GRAPEFRUIT DIET
Most serious dieters at one time or another have been told to eat grapefruit. Proponents of the Grapefruit Diet believe that grapefruit contains a special fat-burning enzyme. 

The Grapefruit Diet, originally called the Hollywood Diet, started in the 1930s and has come back in various forms many times since then. Dieters on this diet are permitted a few vegetables, tiny amounts of Protein and lots of grapefruit. 

The only study conducted into Grapefruit Diets was performed by Johns Hopkins University in Baltimore, and interestingly on behalf of and sponsored by the Florida Citrus Department!

The 13 week diet study consisted of 45 adults with a BMI of 30 kg/m (termed obese) seeking weight loss. All patients were placed on a low-calorie, low-fat diet which was designed to produce an average weight loss of 1-2 pounds per week. All subjects were asked to consume two servings of Florida grapefruit or grapefruit juice each day. (6)

This study, wasn't particularly valuable in proving whether grapefruit works as a weight-loss aid. There was no control group of people who didn't eat any grapefruit and the weight loss experienced by the partints could perfectly be explained by putting any obese person on a low calorie diet, regardless of whether grapefruit was included or not.

The reason that Grapefruit Diets work, as with many other fad diets is because dieters simply limit their caloric intake to less than 900 calories a day. As soon as you come off the diet, you will gain weight again because firstly these diets do nothing to change long term eating habits and secondly the body interprets a crash diet so low in calories as starvation, hence the body compensates by slowing down metabolism to conserve all available energy. This lowered level of metabolism makes future weight loss much more difficult.


In summary grapefruit has no active properties that burn up fat. It is a healthy, high in fibre and low in calorie food that makes a good addition to any healthy diet as should other fruits and vegetables.


References:

(1) The effects of grapefruit pectin on patients at risk for coronary heart disease without altering diet or lifestyle.

Cerda JJ, Robbins FL, Burgin CW, Baumgartner TG, Rice RW.
Department of Medicine, University of Florida College of Medicine, Gainesville 32610. Clin Cardiol. 1988 Sep;11(9):589-94


(2) Inhibition of atherosclerosis by dietary pectin in microswine with sustained hypercholesterolemia. 

Cerda JJ, Normann SJ, Sullivan MP, Burgin CW, Robbins FL, Vathada S, Leelachaikul P.
Department of Medicine, University of Florida College of Medicine, Gainesville.Circulation. 1994 Mar;89(3):1247-53.


(3) A prospective study of tomato products, lycopene, and prostate cancer risk.

Giovannucci E, Rimm EB, Liu Y, Stampfer MJ, Willett WC.
Channing Laboratory, Department of Medicine, Brigham and Women's Hospital and Harvard Medical School, Boston, MA, USA.J Natl Cancer Inst. 2002 Mar 6;94(5):391-8.

(4) Grapefruit juice-drug interactions.
Bailey DG, Malcolm J, Arnold O, Spence JD.
Department of Medicine, London Health Sciences Centre, Ontario, Canada.Br J Clin Pharmacol. 1998 Aug;46(2):101-10. . 

(5) http ://secure.pharmacytimes.com/lessons/200303-02.asp

(6) Johns Hopkins University Weight Management Centre and Florida Dept. of Citrus, P.O. Box 148, Lakeland, FL 33802.
.

----------


## methyl

I got my Dbombs today so i took 10mg with my next meal that i happen to be drinking FRESCA with. I drink a lot of FRESCA because it has 0 cal. Anyway worked out biceps 2hrs later. I had the most extreme workout ever,my arms felt like they were going to fall of or explode. Then i was browsing cycles and saw this article and thought uhoh i remembered reading a soda i drink with grapefruit in it. So this morning i looked and there you go FRESCA is a good grapefruit source for Dbomb. Funny cuz at first i thought grapefruit messed up the drug not enhanced it.

10mg Dbomb + grapefruit cycle lol. cant imagine 10mg morning 10mg preworkout with grapefruit and in my 4th week test e OMG. FYI only 2nd week

----------


## xnotoriousx

Hey anything that might help..... Why not? 

I'm drinking grapefruit extract 3x a day now, i'll see how it goes compared to the first 3 weeks of taking dbol without it.

----------


## xnotoriousx

Rounding week 4

I took a couple progress shots after the 4 week so tell me what you guys think i'm working hard over here... All my lifts are up big!

Starting weight; 202
Now:215

________________*Pre-cycle*_____________________________________*After 4 weeks*




_______________________*Pre-cycle*____________________________________________*After 4 weeks*

----------


## xnotoriousx

*Workout - Shoulder/Calves*
Military press 10,10,8,6
shoulder press machine 12,10,8
side db raise 12,10,8,
DB shrugs 12,10,10

Seated calf 15,12,10,10
Standing calf 15,12,10,10
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
At this point each workout I have is my new best workout i've ever had so that's good... I'm guessing that the rate of gains/strength will drop when I come off the dbol in a week or so... Not looking forward to that. Test should be kicking in, pretty excited to see how I react to it.

----------


## manwitplans

Looking a bit more solid.
Gains have just started to kick in though (week 4).
Some gains from Dbol for sure (about 2 working weeks for strength, 1 for mass).

You are going to look real good afterwards, now enjoy the ride

----------


## green182

Where are the wheels?

You look wider, chest looks a lil bigger and tighter, your forearms look like they are going to explode, and I wish you could get some straight-on shots instead of the angle... Arms look a tad thicker... Delt's look bigger n more defined.

Keep it up

----------


## xnotoriousx

> Where are the wheels?
> 
> You look wider, chest looks a lil bigger and tighter, your forearms look like they are going to explode, and I wish you could get some straight-on shots instead of the angle... Arms look a tad thicker... Delt's look bigger n more defined.
> 
> Keep it up


Thanks for the feedback, was starting to wonder if anyone was following this.

I'll get a wheel pic up.. I'll try to improve the pics also, it's a shitty cam phone i'm just leaning up against a candle on a end table so not much to work with lol...

----------


## xnotoriousx

Here's a couple leg shots, they are getting stronger then anything else, not sure if it's because i've been injecting only quad and gluts or because it's the biggest muscle not really sure. 



Bis are right below the 17" mark so I should have some 17.5 hopefully at the end of this cycle. that would be 3/4 inch gain so i'm hoping to achieve that.

----------


## green182

Man, You have TRANSFORMED since you have been on here. I remember that avatar you had up, what was it a rat or sumthing... I dunno haha but yea man you look Awesome to say the least.

Way better pix. You are Really Proportionate, your legs look great, I can't wait to see em get bigger in the upcoming weeks; your calves look good also (Where I lack) 

Overall you look Solid man. Keep it up man

----------


## xnotoriousx

Thanks bro.

haha yeah it's been a long road and still have so far until i'll be happy... I never really took it to the next level until I became a member of this board. Glad I came to my senses and learned how to eat

Sadly this is my first post ever on here... Check out the stats! LOL
http://forums.steroid.com/showpost.p...17&postcount=1


Excited to see how I react to the test, should kick in anytime now. I was planning on only running the dbol for the first 4 weeks but my workouts have been so damn good and I still have enough for 2 more weeks so i'll just extend it to 6 weeks of dbol @ 40mg ed then ride out the last few weeks on the test e. 

Feeling good much needed rest day today so I got some heavy squats coming my way tomorrow, hoping to break last weeks numbers




> Man, You have TRANSFORMED since you have been on here. I remember that avatar you had up, what was it a rat or sumthing... I dunno haha but yea man you look Awesome to say the least.
> 
> Way better pix. You are Really Proportionate, your legs look great, I can't wait to see em get bigger in the upcoming weeks; your calves look good also (Where I lack) 
> 
> Overall you look Solid man. Keep it up man

----------


## stpete

Good work since march. Keep it up.

----------


## xnotoriousx

> Good work since march. Keep it up.


Thanks bro.

I just changed my diet up some today, i'll be adding in a few egg white with my first meal, dropping carbs from my 5th meal and adding in 2 tbls of olive oil and also i'll be trying to get a extra shake in throughout the day when I get the chance... Just to keep my body adapting and growing (hopefully)

Also my post workout shake is changing from

1cup oats
50g whey
1 med banana

to

60g waxymaize
60g whey
1 med banana

----------


## Mooseman33

please put ur chair and tables to the upright position. 
u are about to take off bro...u are looking good, and anytime the test is going to kick in and ur gains will go thru the roof...

really happy to see someone who really put in the time to learn, and do it right.

keep rocking bro..

----------


## xnotoriousx

Starting weight; 202
Now:215

*Workout - Legs*

Squats 12,10,10,7
Leg Press 12,10,8,6 
Leg curls 12,10,8
Leg extensions 12,10,10,8

3 sets seated calve raise 
3 sets standing calve raise

Moved up in weight on my squats, getting stronger each workout.

----------


## xnotoriousx

Taking a rest day


Pinning went a little crazy today hit something in my quad that made me jerk back and blood shot out. Then after changing the needle and re-injecting I got a really bad pinching pain afterwards but I got it done... I've been doing quads the past 4 pins so maybe it's time to go back to glutes. Plus i'm using a 1.5 inch so maybe I've been going to deep into the quads

----------


## D7M

^yah, I prefer 1" for quads

----------


## xnotoriousx

> ^yah, I prefer 1" for quads


Wish I had some 1" but all I have is 1.5 so i'm skeptical to pin anywhere but quads and glutes

----------


## Mooseman33

just dont insert the pin all the way.

i have to do it sometimes for my delts when i run out of 1"

try ur delts bro, its the easy spot i use..

----------


## collar

great work man, looking great and awesome gains.

solid advice ronnie was giving follow up on it bro.

looking good, keep up the good work and good luck.

----------


## xnotoriousx

Starting weight; 202
Now:217

*Workout - Back and Triceps Supersets*  
2 Sets BB Rows Superset w/ Seated DB extensions
3 Sets Wide Pull Ups Superset w/ Rope Pull down
2 Sets Seated Rows Superset w/ Close Grip BB Press
2 Sets Reverse grip Seated Row Superset w/ Dips

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Thanks for the kind words fellas... I'm working hard.

Switching it up and going with supersets for a week then i'll go back to my normal split. Only a few more days of dbol left then it'll be test time hope my gear is going to kick in good coming up on 5 weeks and still gaining from each workout to the next it seems... Hope gains don't slow down to bad after stopping the dbol.

----------


## xnotoriousx

> just dont insert the pin all the way.
> 
> i have to do it sometimes for my delts when i run out of 1"
> 
> try ur delts bro, its the easy spot i use..



Think I might try delts tonight to give my glutes and quads a break, i'm just worried about going in to far... Only go in 1" on delts right?

----------


## 07sandiegomuscle

> Rounding week 4
> 
> I took a couple progress shots after the 4 week so tell me what you guys think i'm working hard over here... All my lifts are up big!
> 
> Starting weight; 202
> Now:215
> 
> ________________*Pre-cycle*_____________________________________*After 4 weeks*
> 
> ...


The photo on the right you are closer to the camera, so it has the optical illusion of having you look bigger. I can't tell from the pics that you look much different. Can anyone else see a difference if they pay attention that the after pic is taken closer? Sorry, I am not trying to damper your enthusiasm. If you say you are getting stronger then that is that. But I don't see from the pics and I have good vision that there is clearly so much more mass now. Ronnie Rowland posted about people getting stronger without necessarily getting bigger. I wonder if that is what happened. If you are happy that is good. I am not trying to rain on the parade. My first cycle I just gained water and some strength, but not much mass if any like it seems in your pics. I am just trying to sort it out and become more knowledgeable. And I wanted to be honest with what I see.

----------


## D7M

> Think I might try delts tonight to give my glutes and quads a break, i'm just worried about going in to far... Only go in 1" on delts right?


yep, only 1" on delts. 

some peeps cut the needle cap to ensure they don't pin too deep, but I don't care for that. 

just go buy some 1" pins.

----------


## xnotoriousx

> The photo on the right you are closer to the camera, so it has the optical illusion of having you look bigger. I can't tell from the pics that you look much different. Can anyone else see a difference if they pay attention that the after pic is taken closer? Sorry, I am not trying to damper your enthusiasm. If you say you are getting stronger then that is that. But I don't see from the pics and I have good vision that there is clearly so much more mass now. Ronnie Rowland posted about people getting stronger without necessarily getting bigger. I wonder if that is what happened. If you are happy that is good. I am not trying to rain on the parade. My first cycle I just gained water and some strength, but not much mass if any like it seems in your pics. I am just trying to sort it out and become more knowledgeable. And I wanted to be honest with what I see.


I'm nearly standing in the exact same spot with the exact same prop for the camera timer. I'm not a photographer, I just set the timer flex and get the shot. No damage taken though, opinions are like assholes, everybody has one.

I was 202 at start, I am now knocking on 218 gained almost a inch on my arms, quads, everything is bigger. Hate to hear that you had no size gain on your cycle, I think maybe you should turn to your diet to better achieve gains next go round. 


On another note, I did what d7m suggested and it worked like a charm. Delts might be my new spot. I really liked quads until I hit a nerve in them damn that crap burns.

----------


## Mooseman33

told ya, delts are the best..

----------


## Trippensee

> The photo on the right you are closer to the camera, so it has the optical illusion of having you look bigger. I can't tell from the pics that you look much different. Can anyone else see a difference if they pay attention that the after pic is taken closer? Sorry, I am not trying to damper your enthusiasm. If you say you are getting stronger then that is that. But I don't see from the pics and I have good vision that there is clearly so much more mass now. Ronnie Rowland posted about people getting stronger without necessarily getting bigger. I wonder if that is what happened. If you are happy that is good. I am not trying to rain on the parade. My first cycle I just gained water and some strength, but not much mass if any like it seems in your pics. I am just trying to sort it out and become more knowledgeable. And I wanted to be honest with what I see.



You can see in the double bi pose that he has much fuller arms his upper chest is more full as well. the problem is the angles are not exactly the same making it look like there are little gains. You can tell he gained weight throughout.

----------


## Trippensee

> The photo on the right you are closer to the camera, so it has the optical illusion of having you look bigger. I can't tell from the pics that you look much different. Can anyone else see a difference if they pay attention that the after pic is taken closer? Sorry, I am not trying to damper your enthusiasm. If you say you are getting stronger then that is that. But I don't see from the pics and I have good vision that there is clearly so much more mass now. Ronnie Rowland posted about people getting stronger without necessarily getting bigger. I wonder if that is what happened. If you are happy that is good. I am not trying to rain on the parade. My first cycle I just gained water and some strength, but not much mass if any like it seems in your pics. I am just trying to sort it out and become more knowledgeable. And I wanted to be honest with what I see.



You can see in the double bi pose that he has much fuller arms his upper chest is more full as well. the problem is the angles are not exactly the same making it look like there are little gains. You can tell he gained weight throughout.

----------


## darkcrayz

looking thicker man. very noticeable gains. keep up the good work.

----------


## xnotoriousx

Did legs today weight is the same.

Took these today, since starting the adex I think i've dropped a little water because I feel a little leaner.

----------


## wukillabee

> I'm nearly standing in the exact same spot with the exact same prop for the camera timer. I'm not a photographer, I just set the timer flex and get the shot. No damage taken though, opinions are like assholes, everybody has one.
> 
> I was 202 at start, I am now knocking on 218 gained almost a inch on my arms, quads, everything is bigger. Hate to hear that you had no size gain on your cycle, I think maybe you should turn to your diet to better achieve gains next go round. 
> 
> 
> On another note, I did what d7m suggested and it worked like a charm. Delts might be my new spot. I really liked quads until I hit a nerve in them damn that crap burns.


I see a big difference! Mostly in water retnetion though of course. But what else u gonna expect from just 4 weeks of dbol as a kickstart? Muscle tissue already? Keep it up bro!

----------


## wukillabee

> Did legs today weight is the same.
> 
> Took these today, since starting the adex I think i've dropped a little water because I feel a little leaner.


Look a lot more solid in these pics bro! Can even see abs, couldnt see em in last pics so u must be droppin water weight while keeping the size, always good!

----------


## green182

Lookin sick man, greaT motivation...

----------


## xnotoriousx

Thanks fellas i'm going to be trying a few new things to the diet trying to keep leaner and not end up with that heavy bulk look.


For the gains yeah I know most of it has been water but there has hopefully been SOME mucle gained.. There's no way it's all water. Only 5 days left on the dbol so I'll have ran it for almost 6 weeks as a kick start. Hope my gains don't slip to bad when I come off it.

Also with the test, will I know when it kicks in like is it any different from the way dbol makes you feel or what because I haven't noticed anything outside of what the dbol has made me feel like... It should be just about if not already kicking right?

----------


## wukillabee

> Thanks fellas i'm going to be trying a few new things to the diet trying to keep leaner and not end up with that heavy bulk look.
> 
> 
> For the gains yeah I know most of it has been water but there has hopefully been SOME mucle gained.. There's no way it's all water. Only 5 days left on the dbol so I'll have ran it for almost 6 weeks as a kick start. Hope my gains don't slip to bad when I come off it.
> 
> Also with the test, will I know when it kicks in like is it any different from the way dbol makes you feel or what because I haven't noticed anything outside of what the dbol has made me feel like... It should be just about if not already kicking right?


Youll be surprised bro! Reason ur muscles feel hard is granite is cus theyre filled with water, not muscle tissue. I dropped an easy 10lbs the day i stopped anadrol ! Still, dont let it get u down. I see plenty of progress already in u and ur injects havent even kicked yet! For long ester test, part doesnt start for me til week 6 it takes that damn long! Ill never run a long ester again without frontloading it thats for sure!
Lookin solid bro! I got more of the bulk look to me right now but im also on 900mg test, 600mg deca , and 50mg dbol, wouldnt picture me chisled at that right now even if i tried! Still, love how easy pushin big weight feels! I think this will be my last bulk for good, gettin swole and huge takes a toll on me. Gonna focus for now on after this cycle on straight just gettin ripped and preserving what muscle i can along the way! U look bigger when ur ripped anyways and much healthier then just swole. Thats my goal anyways, sorry for ranting to myself on ur thread. Keep it up bro, youll do good!

----------


## xnotoriousx

> Youll be surprised bro! Reason ur muscles feel hard is granite is cus theyre filled with water, not muscle tissue. I dropped an easy 10lbs the day i stopped anadrol ! Still, dont let it get u down. I see plenty of progress already in u and ur injects havent even kicked yet! For long ester test, part doesnt start for me til week 6 it takes that damn long! Ill never run a long ester again without frontloading it thats for sure!
> Lookin solid bro! I got more of the bulk look to me right now but im also on 900mg test, 600mg deca, and 50mg dbol, wouldnt picture me chisled at that right now even if i tried! Still, love how easy pushin big weight feels! I think this will be my last bulk for good, gettin swole and huge takes a toll on me. Gonna focus for now on after this cycle on straight just gettin ripped and preserving what muscle i can along the way! U look bigger when ur ripped anyways and much healthier then just swole. Thats my goal anyways, sorry for ranting to myself on ur thread. Keep it up bro, youll do good!


Yeah I hear you I know i'm holding a good amount of water, because today my weight was dropped 3lbs I think this adex is getting rid of a little bit of it.

Damn that's one hell of a cycle bro! Good luck with it, log looks good.

I agree 100% that you look bigger when you're ripped so 2 weeks after my pct i'll be nailing cardio like a mother and i'm dropping my cals down just a tad below maintenance to lean out to about 10% then i'm going to try to make lean gains natty until next summer... That's the plan anyways  :Smilie:

----------


## ranging1

looking good gawguz

----------


## Yashp

I honestly think you would benefit by janking up the volume. You're running a 3-split+, right? That means the frequency is rather low. Give it a go, you can always back a bit down if you don't feel it suites you  :Smilie:

----------


## xnotoriousx

I do 2 days working out 1 day off.

So my workouts go like this but fall on different days each week

Legs
Chest/bis
off
Back/tris 
shoulders
off 
repeat

So you think I should up the volume of days I workout or are you saying up the volume on my worksets

I'm doin 12-14 on big muscles and 9-12 on smaller ones

----------


## xnotoriousx

Starting weight; 202
Now:213(+11)

*Workout - Shoulders and Cardio* 
Behind Neck Shoulder Press on smith 12,10,10 
Seated Machine Shoulder Press 10,10,8
Upright Rows 10,10,8
DB Side raises 12,10,8

Had a bad ass workout today the shoulder pumps got real intense it was awesome.


30 mins HIIT
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
My weight took a major hit after a few days on this adex, I was holding a fair bit of water and pretty bloated which has went down and I look a little leaner. Hopefully i'll be able to make some solid lean mass gains when this test kicks in.... any..... time..... now..........  :0chink:

----------


## Reed

Just stoppin by.

Looking good my man keep it up  :Smilie:

----------


## xnotoriousx

Just when I was starting to feel kinda big reed shows up....

I'm trying broskie, are you back to bulkin again?

----------


## wukillabee

> I do 2 days working out 1 day off.
> 
> So my workouts go like this but fall on different days each week
> 
> Legs
> Chest/bis
> off
> Back/tris 
> shoulders
> ...


Ur split is good, 2on1off repeat. Many do this for size and strength including powerlifters. Whats this 12-14 for big muscle groups and 9-12 on smaller? Are those working sets? If so, thats wayyyy overtraining imo bro. Ur saying u do 9 "working" sets for bis, 9 working sets for tris, 9 working sets for delts? I dont count warm up sets when i do sets, only working. Reason why im assuming ur talking bout working sets. Even 12 working sets on quads, 12 working sets on hams, etc? Now if ur doing 12-14 working sets on legs all together then thats different. Same if u did 9 working sets total for bis/tris/forearms then that makes sense. Just tryin to calirify here bro what ur sayin. Peeps dont realize it but u can overtrain while on gear, just dont want u to hurt yourself or limit ur gains bro.

----------


## xnotoriousx

> Ur split is good, 2on1off repeat. Many do this for size and strength including powerlifters. Whats this 12-14 for big muscle groups and 9-12 on smaller? Are those working sets? If so, thats wayyyy overtraining imo bro. Ur saying u do 9 "working" sets for bis, 9 working sets for tris, 9 working sets for delts? I dont count warm up sets when i do sets, only working. Reason why im assuming ur talking bout working sets. Even 12 working sets on quads, 12 working sets on hams, etc? Now if ur doing 12-14 working sets on legs all together then thats different. Same if u did 9 working sets total for bis/tris/forearms then that makes sense. Just tryin to calirify here bro what ur sayin. Peeps dont realize it but u can overtrain while on gear, just dont want u to hurt yourself or limit ur gains bro.



Well I do one light set one medium set and one to failure on each exercise so i'll do that on 4 different exercises... I kind of do HIT where there's only one heavy set to failure on each exercise.

----------


## mperk

Dude; you are looking good. Glad u got the adex - that helps alot IMO. Keep the diet clean and continue with the cardio even while you are on cycle. Youwill make some great progress. BTW - i like pinning in the lats too - it's pretty easy and a big muscle - you just give pull one arm up and give yourself a hug with the other. lol BTW I find that the 23ga pins are the best - it's too hard to pump the oil through a 25ga - esp in the awkward spots.

Good luck bro!

----------


## xnotoriousx

Did legs again today so I can switch my schedule to fit a buddy of mines schedule so we can hit some chest and back workouts together we work with the same weight almost exactly so i'm glad to have that back as my last buddy quit on me  :Frown:  The wife pulled the card on him. 

Squats 5x5 ended with 355 for 5 reps not quite parallel but very close to it 
Leg press 1 leg at a time 3 sets each leg
Leg extensions 4 sets

3 sets of standing calve raise

then did 1hour of cardio

Chest/bis tomorrow... Looking forward to it. Only 2 days left of dbol  :Frown: 

Delt injections have been going great little sore for a couple days after but not to bothersome 

Hoping to feel this test kick in on me, it would really help boost my attitude.. Been getting really stressed out about not having any luck on my job search and walking around pissed off a lot lately... I pretty sure it's just stress and not the cycle causing the mood.

----------


## D7M

and hour of cardio after leg day....good for you! 

too many people use leg day as an excuse not to do cardio

----------


## xnotoriousx

> and hour of cardio after leg day....good for you! 
> 
> too many people use leg day as an excuse not to do cardio



I have been one of those people in the past so I won't talk shit  :Smilie: 

I had to step up my cardio. I have been getting these painful bumps up and down my lower leg the past several times jogging outside and on the treadmill so I started to slip on my cardio and boom it caught up fast. So now to rebound a little i've dropped carbs down from my last 2 meals and added healthy fats and have been doing elliptical machine... I don't get the painful bumps in my legs on it so i'm back at it strong. I feel gay using it but there's no pain and i'm goin easy on my knees to so I don't care. Starting to get used to it.

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## mperk

> I have been one of those people in the past so I won't talk shit 
> 
> I had to step up my cardio. I have been getting these painful bumps up and down my lower leg the past several times jogging outside and on the treadmill so I started to slip on my cardio and boom it caught up fast. So now to rebound a little i've dropped carbs down from my last 2 meals and added healthy fats and have been doing elliptical machine... I don't get the painful bumps in my legs on it so i'm back at it strong. I feel gay using it but there's no pain and i'm goin easy on my knees to so I don't care. Starting to get used to it.


Dude - no worries - it's only gay if you are watching Oprah or The View while on the machine....LOL

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## Trippensee

> Dude - no worries - it's only gay if you are watching Oprah or The View while on the machine....LOL


Shit that's gay?

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## Yashp

wukillabee, first off it's not overtraining, but overreaching. Secondly, I don't think that volume is big. If the workout is completed rather quickly - either by supersetting different excersises or simply alternating them -, then there's a decreased chance of CNS burnout. You're not really supposed to worry at all about the muscles; the real danger is the CNS. 

I'd frankly love to see more people try and benefit from gear, most people sit around doing their usual workout; crank it up! Your body can definately handle the pressure, unless you haven't done a real intensive workout in your life - in that case, stay off the gear. If you see any signs of overreaching, such as laziness to an extreme degree, lack of hunger etc., then deload for 2-3 workouts and harvest the gains. Concentrated overload is a great way to gain. 

Stop making a big fuzz about your body being weak - it's not.

Just my 2 cent.

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## xnotoriousx

Well what is your suggestion then? I hear you say crank it up, overload ect lay out an example of what you're talking about. 

Less rest days? More working sets? What exactly are you suggesting?

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## Yashp

Sorry for not being clear enough. Well as you mention yourself, there are more solutions. If the frequency isn't very high, I'd increase the volume to say 4-5 x 10-12 reps (if you're going for highrep), and then do aprox. 3 excercises for big muscles (chest) and 1-2 for smaller ones (delts/biceps). This works quite well for a simple 3-split, but with your current setup concentrated overload for e.g. biceps is quite possible due to the frequency. 

But if I were you, I'd stay with your setup and simply play around with volume and techniques as post/pre-exhaust and dropsets, they're nice to add up some volume. If you see any signs of strength loss or other indicators of overreaching, then simply go back to normal and latter. But it's just a proposal, and the previous post wasn't really aimed at you - your volume is fine I'd say, though not high enough if you ask me, but I just get really annoyed when seeing people not doing more than 4-5 sets per muscle. That's SO underkill.

Try and read up on Stripped Down Hypertrophic Training from ******** - it puts overtraining on the test  :Smilie:

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## mperk

> Shit that's gay?


Maybe that was harsh - it's only gay if you're watching the oprah makeover show and taking notes on the proper use of blush and eyeliner. It's fine if she's got the supermodels talking about bulimia....

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## mperk

> Well what is your suggestion then? I hear you say crank it up, overload ect lay out an example of what you're talking about. 
> 
> Less rest days? More working sets? What exactly are you suggesting?


My suggestion while you are on gear would be to up the weights. I used to do sets of 10 and bump the weight by 10-20lbs every set, but then i was doing 6 sets. So now (on cycle) I do a warmup set with a relatively light weight and then jump right to the middle of where I used to be, keeping it at 3 working sets and making sure i get burned out at 6-8 reps on the last set. you'll make amazing progress and it only gets better as you get deeper into the cycle. be sure to feed your body immediately after the workout, though - you'll be burning cals like crazy!

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## xnotoriousx

> My suggestion while you are on gear would be to up the weights. I used to do sets of 10 and bump the weight by 10-20lbs every set, but then i was doing 6 sets. So now (on cycle) I do a warmup set with a relatively light weight and then jump right to the middle of where I used to be, keeping it at 3 working sets and making sure i get burned out at 6-8 reps on the last set. you'll make amazing progress and it only gets better as you get deeper into the cycle. be sure to feed your body immediately after the workout, though - you'll be burning cals like crazy!


I have been doing those 5x5 on heavy compounds like deads, bench and squat and have noticed good results. I do like the 10-12 range though be never higher then that. Unless cutting.






> the previous post wasn't really aimed at you - your volume is fine I'd say, though not high enough if you ask me, but I just get really annoyed when seeing people not doing more than 4-5 sets per muscle. That's SO underkill.
> 
> Try and read up on Stripped Down Hypertrophic Training from ******** - it puts overtraining on the test



I agree with this totally, I've seen a lot of guys recently talking about doing hardly anything in the gym like you said 6 or less sets per muscle, and I've also noticed they are the ones that are usually shy to take any progress pics. So i'm definitely more for volume but with a good understanding of over training. I look at it like this, if i'm not pouring sweat off my head at the end of my workout from lifting, then my intensity wasn't high enough, rest times were to long ect these are things that go thru my mind if i'm not about to fall over after the workout. 

I don't like drop sets, but I love to go for supersets when feeling a plateau on my back.


On another note, I think the test started kicking in on me last night and almost positive it's kicked in now today because I have sweat running down my back and all over from just sitting here typing this and have been sweating off and on all day which I never do when idle. Is this a good indication that it's kicking in?

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## xnotoriousx

Snapped this one today. I'm starting to notice a much leaner look since dropping carbs adding fats and taking the adex, not sure if it's a bad thing though because my weight took a big hit but I assume it was all water. 218 to 213 in one week. Weight has stopped at 213 for the past few days so i'm thinking just keep it like this but if I continue to lose weight i'm going to have to either try bumping pro higher or carbs back up

I'm at 4k+cals so I should def not be lossing weight

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## biggerguns

> Snapped this one today. I'm starting to notice a much leaner look since dropping carbs adding fats and taking the adex, not sure if it's a bad thing though because my weight took a big hit but I assume it was all water. 218 to 213 in one week. Weight has stopped at 213 for the past few days so i'm thinking just keep it like this but if I continue to lose weight i'm going to have
> 
> [IMG]http://www.axcessmypics.com/photos/photo01/ea/a9/41a78f***5c4.jpg[/IMG]


Pic not working. Just see link/tag that does not work. Im following this thread too BTW. Keep up the hard work.

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## xnotoriousx

Starting weight; 202
Now:213(+11)

*Workout - Chest and Biceps* 
Incline DB Press 10,8,8
Flat BB Press 10,10,8
Incline cable Flys 10,10,8
Weighted Dips 12,10,7
Seated Fly Machine one burn out

Preacher Curls 12,10,8
Standing DB Curls 10, 10, 8
Cable Curls 10,10 8
Burnout set off chin-up negatives (ouch)

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Great ****ing workout today.

I've went up in weight on all of my exercises keeping the same rep ranges but the weight keeps moving up.. 

Bench/squat has gone up dramatically and i'm expecting some new numbers on deads after my long awaited rest day today.... 

I'm going to be LAZZZZZZY! hell I might still do some cardio.

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## the big 1

> Snapped this one today. I'm starting to notice a much leaner look since dropping carbs adding fats and taking the adex, not sure if it's a bad thing though because my weight took a big hit but I assume it was all water. 218 to 213 in one week. Weight has stopped at 213 for the past few days so i'm thinking just keep it like this but if I continue to lose weight i'm going to have to either try bumping pro higher or carbs back up
> 
> I'm at 4k+cals so I should def not be lossing weight


Looking awsome! Great arms m8!

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## biggerguns

Good progress indeed.

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## xnotoriousx

Thanks fellas.

I'm supposed to work back today but damn i'm enjoying this sunday ticket on the big screen to much... Maybe later  :Smilie:  Hopefully.

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## green182

Awesome progress bro.

I can't wait to start up, prolly after the new year.

Are you still planning on the 12 week cycle or the two 8 week cycles?

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## xnotoriousx

Not really sure, i'm being told different things by people who both have respected opinions so i'm going to wait until I feel it lose it's effect then i'll stop, no longer the 12 weeks though.

Had a nice pump goin on earlier today. Didn't seem to lose any strength yet since stopping the dbol . 

Here's a shot from after my back workout, had one hell of a pump going. Arms are just barley shy I mean barley of 17" almost there.

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## xnotoriousx

Starting weight; 202
Now:215(+13)

*Workout - Back and Triceps* 
Wide Pullups 10,10,8
Deads 10,5,5
Seated Rows 10,10,8
Machine Rows 12,10,8

Dips
Dips
Cable Tricep extentions
Rope
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Weight is starting to go back up +2 so i'm assuming the test is kicking in. Also have some acne popping up on my back that I never get, not that it's a good thing but also another indicator that the test is kicked in. Feeling pretty good all around. 

Went back to quad injects because they seem to give the least amount of discomfort the following days after injections plus if the spot injecting myth is true i'd love to benefit there more then anywhere. I really liked how simple and easy the delts were but damn 4 days after I still had shouler stiffness in both delts from it.

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## mperk

> Not really sure, i'm being told different things by people who both have respected opinions so i'm going to wait until I feel it lose it's effect then i'll stop, no longer the 12 weeks though.
> 
> Had a nice pump goin on earlier today. Didn't seem to lose any strength yet since stopping the dbol . 
> 
> Here's a shot from after my back workout, had one hell of a pump going. Arms are just barley shy I mean barley of 17" almost there.


Awesome dude! IMO good that you got on the adex to limit the water gain. You are looking noticeably thicker - and your arms are def swole! Time to buy some new shirts - Hahahahaha

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## xnotoriousx

first one is after a couple weeks, next one is today after not taking dbol for a few days and taking the adex I dropped some water for sure.

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## xnotoriousx

My only real complaint I have right now is puffy nips, can't seem to get them gone for good. Took nolva at 40mg for a few days and then started taking adex at .25ed and then dropped it to .25 eod now they are puffy again so they're taking my brain for a spin. I am going to start taking the nolva at 10mg ed and the adex at .25 ed and see how it goes from there.

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## green182

> My only real complaint I have right now is puffy nips, can't seem to get them gone for good. Took nolva at 40mg for a few days and then started taking adex at .25ed and then dropped it to .25 eod now they are puffy again so they're taking my brain for a spin. I am going to start taking the nolva at 10mg ed and the adex at .25 ed and see how it goes from there.


Lets see a pic.

Arms and back are lookin crazy..

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## mperk

> My only real complaint I have right now is puffy nips, can't seem to get them gone for good. Took nolva at 40mg for a few days and then started taking adex at .25ed and then dropped it to .25 eod now they are puffy again so they're taking my brain for a spin. I am going to start taking the nolva at 10mg ed and the adex at .25 ed and see how it goes from there.


I'd recommend the adex at .5 ed at bedtime. The nolva - I don't know how that would affect your nipps. Good luck broseph!

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## darkcrayz

seeing those traps pop. back looking tight man. good job.

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## xnotoriousx

Thanks fellas, had a curve ball thrown at me yet again.

Got a call from a job i've been after for awhile and it's going to be travel and fast pace won't be able to eat every 3 hours and meals workout days will have to drop to 3 a week.

I'm not sure if I should just stop my cycle or finish it out with the sub par diet. 


Any opinions/advice?

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## mperk

If it's a short term job, maybe stop the cycle and pick it up later. If it's a year plus - finish the cycle and see hoe you can do your best while working. Even doing pushups, etc in your hotel will help out - you'll have to get more creative. Maybe get some of those power bands too. Don't put off fitness for work - I did that for 8 years - HUGE mistake.

Good luck broski!

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## xnotoriousx

I hear that, i'll never put off fitness, I love my workouts but as far as bodybuilding goes I think it may have to come to an end. 4kcals for me is a TASK, and with this new job i'm going to have to be very focused and I know for a fact if I have to eat 4 500cal meals while at work it's going to take away my focus from work. 

Would it be stupid to just continue my cycle with lower cals and just finish it out as a cut?

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## mperk

Yup - I hear you - the eating is a HUGE part of being successful - esp on cycle! Maybe you can look into Scivation's new meal replacement shake - you could def do that at a desk. (what kind of job is it?) Either way it won't be ideal but you'll do well. IMO you don't really need a cut atm - but that's up to you. Make sure you do the full PCT tho - you'll def regret it if you don't. I found that when the test left my system and I was waiting for the natty to kick back in, I was moody, depressed, etc.

Good luck bro!

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## xnotoriousx

I'll be cutting my cycle off at 8 weeks. Thanks to everyone that has followed and I hate that I couldn't continue on my bulking diet I was really starting to pack it on but it is what it is. I'll still post some pics after PCT just to let people know how it went. Expect me to look MUCH leaner lol

Any advice on PCT?

Clomid 50/50/50/50
Nolva 40/20/20/20 

This is what I had planned... Look good to everyone?

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## Mooseman33

copntinue on bro, dont stop cycle yet..
if u dont eat every 3 hours u will be fine bro. u have put in a ton of hard work, these are the payoff days now..

stay on cycle bro, ur only do 2 shots a week...finish the game bro..

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## xnotoriousx

yeah **** it, i'm just going to finish it out the best I can. Heres some wheel shots I took the other day. I know they're not big but boy have they come a long way. KFC used to ask me for my recipe  :Stick Out Tongue:

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## Mooseman33

that a boy...
keep at it, do what u can and the test will do the rest. u have worked ur ass off to get to this point, this is when it will get fun and u will grow like a weed.

progress looks great so far man, keep it up.

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## xnotoriousx

they're starting to come out of hiding...

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## green182

Dam man nice.. What does your ab schedule look like?
What workouts and how often do you train your abs?

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## xnotoriousx

I'd say on avg I work abs once a week

I always like to do a 3 exercise circuit three sets.. 

Hanging leg raises to failure + DB side bends(45lbs) + Decline sit ups 60second rest then repeat

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## xnotoriousx

Starting weight; 202
Now:209(+7) Losing weight now  :Frown: 

*Workout - Shoulders/Calves/Abs* 
Behind Neck Mil Press 12,10,10
Upright Rows 12,10,8
Reverse Cable flys 10,10,8

Seated calve raise 15,12,10
Standing calve raise 15,12,10

Abs circuit

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Down 6lbs in 2 weeks which means I need to up my food intake just a bit, I don't mind losing some weight as i've already planned on dropping calories but I don't want to lose more then 2 a week. On the plus side i'm leaning out very quickly and look much better so i'm happy about that.

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## mperk

Nice work broski - you made some great progress there!

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## xnotoriousx

> Nice work broski - you made some great progress there!


Thanks mperk I appreciate all your help in this thread as well as my old natty log.

Few more weeks till the end of my cycle, i'm going to enjoy looking at the 1 year before and after photos lol this will be my first time ever going a entire year without taking a long break. I'm happy about that.

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## xnotoriousx

You guys don't even wanna know what I just did....

Been 6 days without a cheat right....

Waffle house - All Star eggs+cheese, toast, bacon, hashbrowns with a big ass waffle covered with butter/syrup, crushed it in like 6-7 minutes like it never happened 

Damn I feel like I did something illegal...  :AaGreen22:

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## ranging1

good job mate, LOOK GREAT

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## xnotoriousx

> good job mate, LOOK GREAT


I appreciate it man. I know from this point I could have done better but I think that's always the case no matter how good you do. My goal from the start was to be 200-205 at 10% so i'll be happy as hell if after pct I can hold onto that.

Any bodyfat guesstimations?

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## Trippensee

Honestly, you did a sick job bro. I remember when you first posted that picture of yourself doing some pose holding a railing with your shirt open (weird, btw.) and now you have forearms the size of your legs back then. Keep it up and keep at a general diet. You can still grow but at least you proved to yourself and everyone else here that you could do it the right way. I congratulate you...
 :Nutkick:

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## dangerous dan

> I appreciate it man. I know from this point I could have done better but I think that's always the case no matter how good you do. My goal from the start was to be 200-205 at 10% so i'll be happy as hell if after pct I can hold onto that.
> 
> Any bodyfat guesstimations?


id say about 12. maybe less.

you look bang on mate

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## Slaktar

Great job man. An amazing transformation, i`m sure you have inspired many, including me..

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## methyl

yeah i got discouraged from weight staying same off dbol then realized its cuz mass is so much gain and water flys off me, thats just how i am , that the weight appeared same. I cant keep water even on dbol i only gained about 2-5 lbs water for some reason i never retain water unless on some anabolic , test cant do it to me, thank god !

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## xnotoriousx

I appreciate everyones comments, really helps motivate me. Only about one more week left on cycle and I think i'm going to come off... That'll make it a 10 week cycle... I have enough to run 12 weeks but from what everyone says they lose effect at 8 so I don't see the point in going past 10

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## dangerous dan

> I appreciate everyones comments, *really helps motivate me.* Only about one more week left on cycle and I think i'm going to come off... That'll make it a 10 week cycle... I have enough to run 12 weeks but from what everyone says they lose effect at 8 so I don't see the point in going past 10


right back at ya.

great work, the arms are looking great. everything looks in proportion. hopefully ill be in that shape someday  :Roll Eyes (Sarcastic):  

sorry if i missed it notorious...but what bf was you at before cycle??

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## Aizen Sosuke

> I appreciate everyones comments, really helps motivate me. Only about one more week left on cycle and I think i'm going to come off... That'll make it a 10 week cycle... I have enough to run 12 weeks but from what everyone says they lose effect at 8 so I don't see the point in going past 10


A wise desicion. If you see gains dissappear why stay on? Now you know you respond better to shorter cycles.

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## xnotoriousx

> right back at ya.
> 
> great work, the arms are looking great. everything looks in proportion. hopefully ill be in that shape someday  
> 
> sorry if i missed it notorious...but what bf was you at before cycle??


I was somewhere around 13-14% at 202lbs

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## Apexaddicted

Nice gains man. I've been following your progress. I'd say aside from the puffy nipples, a pretty good cycle. Hope the next one goes good.

-Rob

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## xnotoriousx

> Nice gains man. I've been following your progress. I'd say aside from the puffy nipples, a pretty good cycle. Hope the next one goes good.
> 
> -Rob


Thanks man...

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## xnotoriousx

Here's a pic taken today while doin some chest/back supersets

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## green182

You sick muther F^cker...

I just got some omni's and I am planning a 10 weeker... I hope I see similar results!

BTW I might be PM'ing you from time to time with sum ?'s

GREAT JOB Man!

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## manwitplans

Sick last picture, hard as nails

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## xnotoriousx

> You sick muther F^cker...
> 
> I just got some omni's and I am planning a 10 weeker... I hope I see similar results!
> 
> BTW I might be PM'ing you from time to time with sum ?'s
> 
> GREAT JOB Man!


thanks bro yeah anytime if I can help, I will.

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## eutecticpoint

Good progress so far man. particularly for some of the unexpected surprises you've had, those always throw me off my game. Keep it up!

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## energizer bunny

Hey notorious...looking good...jacked to bits....good work

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## verino

looks like you put in some hard work..lookin good

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## xnotoriousx

Hey guys, figured i'd shoot a update, going into my 3rd week of pct and I gotta tell you, it has sucked. Been working 7 days a week out of town for the past month with no access to a gym and my diet hasn't been that great either... 

Hit the gym for the first time in 2 weeks today and strength is DOWN BIG TIME... Lost 1/2 inch on my bicep!! 

If I knew that this would happen at the end of my cycle I would have never run it, but it is what it is. This time last year I was 185 at around 14-15% and now i'm at 205 around 13% so i'll just make sure I set a good new years resolution... Thanks to all the people that gave me encouragement in this thread it really helped me reach goals and I appreciate it.

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## BJJ

Will you cycle for 12 weeks... as reported on post 1?

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## xnotoriousx

> Will you cycle for 12 weeks... as reported on post 1?


no I only ran it for 10 weeks. Now doing a 4 week pct about to start my 3rd week.

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## BJJ

> no I only ran it for 10 weeks. Now doing a 4 week pct about to start my 3rd week.


Any particular reason for this 2 weeks cut?

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## Aizen Sosuke

Come on bro. This is a crucial time in your cycle. Don't fold or it'll be all for naught.

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## beatango2008

awesome progress bro, hope my cycle goes as well as yours

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## xnotoriousx

> Any particular reason for this 2 weeks cut?


Yeah I was advised by a number of people to run a shorter cycle, also I felt my gains slow down quite a bit after 8 weeks.

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## BJJ

> Yeah I was advised by a number of people to run a shorter cycle, also I felt my gains slow down quite a bit after 8 weeks.


That's what I thought.

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## xnotoriousx

man i felt so much better when I was on cycle this sucks lol  :Frown:

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## xnotoriousx

Round 2 coming soon!!!

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## xnotoriousx

Diet will be similar to my first go round  :Smilie: 

week 1-12 500mg test-e/cyp 
week 1-14 600mg eq 
week 1-4 40mg dbol 

pct 
clomid 100/50/50/25
nolva 40/40/20/20

any thoughts?

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## xnotoriousx

damn, I might just do a personal log. It doesn't look like many people check these anymore :/

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## Wonder_Juice

In my oppinion you shouldnt run the boldenon after finishing test... And it would be better if you run 400 or 500mg of boldenone , so it shouldnt exceed the amount of the test.

PCT is solid, i will do the same (with T-bomb)

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## BurntRbr

Great writeup. will follow!

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