# STEROIDS FORUM > ANABOLIC STEROIDS - QUESTIONS & ANSWERS >  Strongest cut/hardner cycle

## gymfu

Hey, so I'm wondering if anyone has tried to run high doses of masteron , tren , and/or winny and had better results with getting harder and leaner.

I ran a prop (100mg), masteron (100mg), tren a (100mg), and winny (50mg) all EOD, and anavar (100mg) ED. For 12 weeks. results were great but need to get harder and leaner next time.

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## gixxerboy1

thats alot. fix your diet if you need to get leaner not higher doses

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## gymfu

My diet doesn't need fixing, I went from 15% down to 5%. I'm looking to get harder not so much leaner I guess.
Thx

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## gixxerboy1

your 5% and need to get harder? Then you arent 5%

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## bodybuilder

Lol 5% how hard do you wana get bro.

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## jelly

Try throwing some viagra in the cycle. That'll make it harder.

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## ddp2727

> Try throwing some viagra in the cycle. That'll make it harder.


Too funny man!

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## songdog

Yeah you need to post a pic.You ran enough juice to make 10 guys hard.And you didnt drop 10% bf that fast.POST PIC.

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## Bonaparte

I guess you could lower the test dose, drop the Var, and bump the Winny to 100mg daily.
And if this is for a show or something, then add in some Halo for the last 3 weeks. But if this is just for vanity's sake...disregard everything I just posted and go see a psychologist.

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## bodybuilder

> I guess you could lower the test dose, drop the Var, and bump the Winny to 100mg daily.
> And if this is for a show or something, then add in some Halo for the last 3 weeks. But if this is just for vanity's sake...disregard everything I just posted and go see a psychologist.


Lol I have to agree

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## The Titan99

> Hey, so I'm wondering if anyone has tried to run high doses of masteron , tren , and/or winny and had better results with getting harder and leaner.
> 
> I ran a prop (100mg), masteron (100mg), tren a (100mg), and winny (50mg) all EOD, and anavar (100mg) ED. For 12 weeks. results were great but need to get harder and leaner next time.


 HA!! Toss in some clen and T3. Joking, but not really.... Seriously though, I've run some pretty high doses of similar stuff (no winny though, my joints can't take it) but I don't feel comfortable posting it!!

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## auslifta

> Hey, so I'm wondering if anyone has tried to run high doses of masteron , tren , and/or winny and had better results with getting harder and leaner.
> 
> I ran a prop (100mg), masteron (100mg), tren a (100mg), and winny (50mg) all EOD, and anavar (100mg) ED. For 12 weeks. results were great but need to get harder and leaner next time.



If you can't get what you want from that cycle, you're doing something else wrong. Or you're really wrong in the head, seek help.

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## The Titan99

You'll get what you want, but only if diet and training is spot on.

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## gymfu

I did drop 10% in 11 weeks. The diet and cardio was brutal! When the contest pics finaly get posted I will grab one and post it here. 

5% bf doesnt mean you have hard muscle tissue it just means that you don't have that much fat on top of your muscles. I need to get harder to be more competitive.

Just wondering if anyone has tried more tren or masteron , since those are the two best hardeners in this cycle.

BTY I was also using clen and t3 for burning fat.

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## Bonaparte

Oral Winstrol is actually the best hardner you're going to find (besides Halo maybe).

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## dec11

> I did drop 10% in 11 weeks. The diet and cardio was brutal! When the contest pics finaly get posted I will grab one and post it here. 
> 
> 5% bf doesnt mean you have hard muscle tissue it just means that you don't have that much fat on top of your muscles. I need to get harder to be more competitive.
> 
> Just wondering if anyone has tried more tren or masteron , since those are the two best hardeners in this cycle.
> 
> BTY I was also using clen and t3 for burning fat.


pics!! 10% is a major lot in 11wks

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## gymfu

> pics!! 10% is a major lot in 11wks


I said I would when they finaly get posted. Been checking several times per day.

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## gymfu

> Oral Winstrol is actually the best hardner you're going to find (besides Halo maybe).


Would oral winny really give me better results then inj version? Is it safe to use 100mg of var and oral winny? I like my liver! lol

Don't know about halo, I'll check into it. Thx.

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## dec11

> I said I would when they finaly get posted. Been checking several times per day.


take a pic of yourself now? interested to see you at competition level

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## gymfu

I don't really like this photo, but there are some doubters in here so here it is. I'll post some better ones when I get them.

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## dec11

> I don't really like this photo, but there are some doubters in here so here it is. I'll post some better ones when I get them.


lookin good, symmetry looks good, lats holding you back alittle

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## gymfu

> lookin good, symmetry looks good, lats holding you back alittle


Thanks, I know my lats are a weak point. Any tips on getting a little harder?

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## Bonaparte

You didn't look "hard" enough simply because you weren't lean enough. You look way too smooth in that pic to be 5% BF (where you should be for a show). 5% should look a lot grainier.

Var is a decent cutting/performance drug, but it is not the best pre-contest option. Again, skip the Var next time and save your liver for all the Winstrol and Halo you can handle (in the last few weeks).
And yeah, oral winstrol should work a bit better for your purposes than injections. This is because it binds up SHBG better and releases more IGF-1, which will help more with that "paper-thin" skin look. The injections just provide a bit more anabolism, but that isn't what you need for hardening (and there are much more anabolic drugs out there).

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## gymfu

> You didn't look "hard" enough simply because you weren't lean enough. You look way too smooth in that pic to be 5% BF (where you should be for a show). 5% should look a lot grainier.
> 
> Var is a decent cutting/performance drug, but it is not the best pre-contest option. Again, skip the Var next time and save your liver for all the Winstrol and Halo you can handle (in the last few weeks).
> And yeah, oral winstrol should work a bit better for your purposes than injections. This is because it binds up SHBG better and releases more IGF-1, which will help more with that "paper-thin" skin look. The injections just provide a bit more anabolism, but that isn't what you need for hardening (and there are much more anabolic drugs out there).


Ok, thanks. The body fat measurment was done my a friend with calipers, I know its not the most acurate. Maybe I was higher? Thanks for the info.

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## dec11

these spammy cvnts always seem to use ICQ, would there be a way of preventing someone signing up when they use that service in their profile?

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## rhino6218

yeah bro i was talking with a guy w/ a phd in nutritional science and he criticed my last competition pic for me and told me that my bf was prob about 2-3% higher cuz calipers have too much variance... :Frown:  hurt my little feelings, but it is the truth. i can say that harder thing is normally accomplished by using carbohydrates adequatley. i see people wipe their carbs out in an attempt to get shredded but they are only decreasing fat by some, but losing alot of muscle...so in turn they lose that thick full appearance that we have before we step onstage. i will try timing carbs differently or maybe change carb sources...different strokes, different folks. pic looks great btw keep it up bro

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## rhino6218

*i would

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## gymfu

Hey, so I'm wondering if anyone has tried to run high doses of masteron , tren , and/or winny and had better results with getting harder and leaner.

I ran a prop (100mg), masteron (100mg), tren a (100mg), and winny (50mg) all EOD, and anavar (100mg) ED. For 12 weeks. results were great but need to get harder and leaner next time.

----------


## gixxerboy1

thats alot. fix your diet if you need to get leaner not higher doses

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## gymfu

My diet doesn't need fixing, I went from 15% down to 5%. I'm looking to get harder not so much leaner I guess.
Thx

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## gixxerboy1

your 5% and need to get harder? Then you arent 5%

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## bodybuilder

Lol 5% how hard do you wana get bro.

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## jelly

Try throwing some viagra in the cycle. That'll make it harder.

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## ddp2727

> Try throwing some viagra in the cycle. That'll make it harder.


Too funny man!

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## songdog

Yeah you need to post a pic.You ran enough juice to make 10 guys hard.And you didnt drop 10% bf that fast.POST PIC.

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## Bonaparte

I guess you could lower the test dose, drop the Var, and bump the Winny to 100mg daily.
And if this is for a show or something, then add in some Halo for the last 3 weeks. But if this is just for vanity's sake...disregard everything I just posted and go see a psychologist.

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## bodybuilder

> I guess you could lower the test dose, drop the Var, and bump the Winny to 100mg daily.
> And if this is for a show or something, then add in some Halo for the last 3 weeks. But if this is just for vanity's sake...disregard everything I just posted and go see a psychologist.


Lol I have to agree

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## The Titan99

> Hey, so I'm wondering if anyone has tried to run high doses of masteron , tren , and/or winny and had better results with getting harder and leaner.
> 
> I ran a prop (100mg), masteron (100mg), tren a (100mg), and winny (50mg) all EOD, and anavar (100mg) ED. For 12 weeks. results were great but need to get harder and leaner next time.


 HA!! Toss in some clen and T3. Joking, but not really.... Seriously though, I've run some pretty high doses of similar stuff (no winny though, my joints can't take it) but I don't feel comfortable posting it!!

----------


## auslifta

> Hey, so I'm wondering if anyone has tried to run high doses of masteron , tren , and/or winny and had better results with getting harder and leaner.
> 
> I ran a prop (100mg), masteron (100mg), tren a (100mg), and winny (50mg) all EOD, and anavar (100mg) ED. For 12 weeks. results were great but need to get harder and leaner next time.



If you can't get what you want from that cycle, you're doing something else wrong. Or you're really wrong in the head, seek help.

----------


## The Titan99

You'll get what you want, but only if diet and training is spot on.

----------


## gymfu

I did drop 10% in 11 weeks. The diet and cardio was brutal! When the contest pics finaly get posted I will grab one and post it here. 

5% bf doesnt mean you have hard muscle tissue it just means that you don't have that much fat on top of your muscles. I need to get harder to be more competitive.

Just wondering if anyone has tried more tren or masteron , since those are the two best hardeners in this cycle.

BTY I was also using clen and t3 for burning fat.

----------


## Bonaparte

Oral Winstrol is actually the best hardner you're going to find (besides Halo maybe).

----------


## dec11

> I did drop 10% in 11 weeks. The diet and cardio was brutal! When the contest pics finaly get posted I will grab one and post it here. 
> 
> 5% bf doesnt mean you have hard muscle tissue it just means that you don't have that much fat on top of your muscles. I need to get harder to be more competitive.
> 
> Just wondering if anyone has tried more tren or masteron , since those are the two best hardeners in this cycle.
> 
> BTY I was also using clen and t3 for burning fat.


pics!! 10% is a major lot in 11wks

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## gymfu

> pics!! 10% is a major lot in 11wks


I said I would when they finaly get posted. Been checking several times per day.

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## gymfu

> Oral Winstrol is actually the best hardner you're going to find (besides Halo maybe).


Would oral winny really give me better results then inj version? Is it safe to use 100mg of var and oral winny? I like my liver! lol

Don't know about halo, I'll check into it. Thx.

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## dec11

> I said I would when they finaly get posted. Been checking several times per day.


take a pic of yourself now? interested to see you at competition level

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## gymfu

I don't really like this photo, but there are some doubters in here so here it is. I'll post some better ones when I get them.

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## dec11

> I don't really like this photo, but there are some doubters in here so here it is. I'll post some better ones when I get them.


lookin good, symmetry looks good, lats holding you back alittle

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## gymfu

> lookin good, symmetry looks good, lats holding you back alittle


Thanks, I know my lats are a weak point. Any tips on getting a little harder?

----------


## Bonaparte

You didn't look "hard" enough simply because you weren't lean enough. You look way too smooth in that pic to be 5% BF (where you should be for a show). 5% should look a lot grainier.

Var is a decent cutting/performance drug, but it is not the best pre-contest option. Again, skip the Var next time and save your liver for all the Winstrol and Halo you can handle (in the last few weeks).
And yeah, oral winstrol should work a bit better for your purposes than injections. This is because it binds up SHBG better and releases more IGF-1, which will help more with that "paper-thin" skin look. The injections just provide a bit more anabolism, but that isn't what you need for hardening (and there are much more anabolic drugs out there).

----------


## gymfu

> You didn't look "hard" enough simply because you weren't lean enough. You look way too smooth in that pic to be 5% BF (where you should be for a show). 5% should look a lot grainier.
> 
> Var is a decent cutting/performance drug, but it is not the best pre-contest option. Again, skip the Var next time and save your liver for all the Winstrol and Halo you can handle (in the last few weeks).
> And yeah, oral winstrol should work a bit better for your purposes than injections. This is because it binds up SHBG better and releases more IGF-1, which will help more with that "paper-thin" skin look. The injections just provide a bit more anabolism, but that isn't what you need for hardening (and there are much more anabolic drugs out there).


Ok, thanks. The body fat measurment was done my a friend with calipers, I know its not the most acurate. Maybe I was higher? Thanks for the info.

----------


## dec11

these spammy cvnts always seem to use ICQ, would there be a way of preventing someone signing up when they use that service in their profile?

----------


## rhino6218

yeah bro i was talking with a guy w/ a phd in nutritional science and he criticed my last competition pic for me and told me that my bf was prob about 2-3% higher cuz calipers have too much variance... :Frown:  hurt my little feelings, but it is the truth. i can say that harder thing is normally accomplished by using carbohydrates adequatley. i see people wipe their carbs out in an attempt to get shredded but they are only decreasing fat by some, but losing alot of muscle...so in turn they lose that thick full appearance that we have before we step onstage. i will try timing carbs differently or maybe change carb sources...different strokes, different folks. pic looks great btw keep it up bro

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## rhino6218

*i would

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