# FITNESS and NUTRITION FORUM > DIET AND NUTRITION >  Bread yes or no?

## Exilus

is it good carbs? each slice of bread got like 120 calories and i can eat half a dozen anytime. My pre-bed meal usually consists of grapes, 6 bread slices and a tuna can.

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## matt77

What kind of bread? There are 100s of bread types some good and some bad. If your eating 6 slices of white bread at bed thats bad but if its a whole wheat or sprouted bread it may be good depending on your goals and body. As a general rule though I don't consume bread at all about 4-5 hours before bed. If you need a carb before bed try brown rice. Really the only time you should eat that amount of simple carbs is PWO (assuming its white bread or cheap knock off wheat bread)

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## gbrice75

> is it good carbs? each slice of bread got like 120 calories and i can eat half a dozen anytime. My pre-bed meal usually consists of grapes, 6 bread slices and a tuna can.


Bread is not a preferred carb source no matter which type, mainly because it's not a whole food/natural source. If you have to eat bread, Ezekiel or something like that would be your best bet.

Eating bread and grapes before bed is a really bad idea IMO, no need for all those carbs to be in your system while you sleep.

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## PC650

actually im a big believer in whole wheat bread. i eat a loaf a day on carb day. if im on a cycle and im bulking ill have 4 slices before bed along with my eggs. it works good for me..

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## gbrice75

> actually im a big believer in whole wheat bread. i eat a loaf a day on carb day. if im on a cycle and im bulking ill have 4 slices before bed along with my eggs. it works good for me..


Not flaming, just curious - are you concerned with fat gain while you're bulking?

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## JinNtonic

> actually im a big believer in whole wheat bread. i eat a loaf a day on carb day. if im on a cycle and im bulking ill have 4 slices before bed along with my eggs. it works good for me..


Dude, I got fatter just reading this...

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## YoungGunsNY

LOL at the above comment.

But what is you're logic for eating carbs before bed, especially the meal before bed?? I cut them out 2 meals before bed. Are you trying to put fat on??

What does the rest of your diet look like? I can't imagine it would be approved by many just based upon eating carbs, bread no less, before bed. I wouldn't eat bread because it's manufactured bullsh!t that does not truly contain whole grain/wheat - except ezekial bread which I have yet to find by me.

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## Bigdog99

Anyone ever try Arnold Double Protein Bread? 7 grams of protein per slice. Thoughts? Good? No Good? 

http://www.arnoldbread.com/Products/...KU=7341001374#

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## JinNtonic

IMO sleep + carbs = fat, not muscle.

But everyone is different.

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## PC650

haha actually my body fat has stayed the same the last year, i currently carb cycle, and actually have lost fat rather than gained. when i bulk and on a cycle i try and take in 500 grams of carbs a day.

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## PC650

> LOL at the above comment.
> 
> But what is you're logic for eating carbs before bed, especially the meal before bed?? I cut them out 2 meals before bed. Are you trying to put fat on??
> 
> What does the rest of your diet look like? I can't imagine it would be approved by many just based upon eating carbs, bread no less, before bed. I wouldn't eat bread because it's manufactured bullsh!t that does not truly contain whole grain/wheat - except ezekial bread which I have yet to find by me.


for one im not trying to be cut like most of you want , i like to be around the 10-15% range. imo that suites me the best.  :Nutkick:

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## sean_holland

> for one im not trying to be cut like most of you want , i like to be around the 10-15% range. imo that suites me the best.


Anything below 12% seems like a task. There is no ribbon for having the most shredded abs of all time. I'll take being satisfied in my day to day life, not having to avoid real human meals and still having abs, as opposed to hovering on obsessive compulsive behavior.

I'm all for doing what works 'FOR YOU'.

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## Damienm05

> Anything below 12% seems like a task. There is no ribbon for having the most shredded abs of all time. I'll take being satisfied in my day to day life, not having to avoid real human meals and still having abs, as opposed to hovering on obsessive compulsive behavior.
> 
> I'm all for doing what works 'FOR YOU'.


And what works for some of us is the constant pursuit of the 'most shredded abs of all time'. I like manipulating my diet constantly to achieve my goals. In fact, I enjoy better food and consume more of it than most people who aren't attempting to be below 10% bf. Seared ahi, Whole meal linguine with clams and evoo/garlic sauce, steak and sweet potatoes every day. 

Good post though, just saying there's a happy medium.

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## sean_holland

> And what works for some of us is the constant pursuit of the 'most shredded abs of all time'. I like manipulating my diet constantly to achieve my goals. In fact, I enjoy better food and consume more of it than most people who aren't attempting to be below 10% bf. Seared ahi, Whole meal linguine with clams and evoo/garlic sauce, steak and sweet potatoes every day. 
> 
> Good post though, just saying *there's a happy medium.*


You are spot on my friend, a happy medium is what you need to find for a sound body and mind. Shredded abs are great, I'm on that same pursuit. But I have a wife, I can't get anymore BJ's on a count of my Abs looking great so I have to enjoy things on a sensible basis as well.

: )

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## bber99

> IMO sleep + carbs = fat, not muscle.
> 
> But everyone is different.


why?

Why would you avoid carbs before you are about to fast for 8 hours?

Do you seriously still believe the myth that carbs at night make you fat?

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## Damienm05

> why?
> 
> Why would you avoid carbs before you are about to fast for 8 hours?
> 
> Do you seriously still believe the myth that carbs at night make you fat?


How is it a myth? I think anyone with a good knowledge of BB diets will tell you with absolute certainty that carbs before bed will not be used due to a lack of energy expenditure and can very easily be stored as extra energy (fat). Unless, of course, your glycogen is fully depleted from the day's activity and that's unlikely unless you've just ran a marathon or ate only pro/fat meals 1-6.

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## Damienm05

> You are spot on my friend, a happy medium is what you need to find for a sound body and mind. Shredded abs are great, I'm on that same pursuit. But I have a wife, I can't get anymore BJ's on a count of my Abs looking great so I have to enjoy things on a sensible basis as well.
> 
> : )


I have mad respect for you married guys who maintain a nice physique. I was kinda chunky around the midsection when engaged, haha. I still lifted but had no urge to be ripped up.

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## PC650

ya i have no urge for being ripped either. i can care less for abs

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## bber99

> How is it a myth? I think anyone with a good knowledge of BB diets will tell you with absolute certainty that carbs before bed will not be used due to a lack of energy expenditure and can very easily be stored as extra energy (fat). Unless, of course, your glycogen is fully depleted from the day's activity and that's unlikely unless you've just ran a marathon or ate only pro/fat meals 1-6.


ok

So if we have 300 calories from carbs vs 300 calories from fat

Even if our glycogen stores are not depleted, why will carbohydrates be more likely to be stored as fat...than fat?
You realize that carbs cannot be stored directly as fat because they have to undergo denovolipogenesis (which NEVER happens) actually carbs are rarely ever stored as fat, its just that when you have an extreme excess of carbs that your body spends all day utilizing the carbs as energy that the fat that is consumed is almost an afterthought, and then stored in adipose.

So, carbs can't be stored directly as fat...BUT triglycerides can, so why would this make them a better choice before bed? 

I'm not saying fat is bad in anyway, I'm just against the whole myth of carbs before bed being bad....I mean what if I work out right before I go to bed? You'd better believe that the majority of my carbs will be around my workout and that means a ton of carbs right before bed...

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## mikeyc

> So, carbs can't be stored directly as fat...BUT triglycerides can, so why would this make them a better choice before bed?


What does insulin do then? It is as direct as you are going to get. I do not believe there is an equivalent hormone for fats. And even the long chain fatty acids you eat have to be broken down to glycerol and acid chains before they are restructured as triglycerides.

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## bber99

> What does insulin do then? It is as direct as you are going to get. I do not believe there is an equivalent hormone for fats. And even the long chain fatty acids you eat have to be broken down to glycerol and acid chains before they are restructured as triglycerides.


insulin takes glucose to cells....it doesn't store fat.....although fat won't be used as an energy source when insulin is present because the body is then using glucose as energy


and...fat is more easily stored as fat than carbs are, a crazy excess in carbs means that they will be oxidized as energy for a longer period of time (this is so the body can maintain glucose levels) and the use of fat as energy is put on the backburner

Regardless, carbs shouldn't be feared before bed as long as they are calculated into the metabolic demands of the individuals metabolism

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## gbrice75

> insulin takes glucose to cells....it doesn't store fat.....although fat won't be used as an energy source when insulin is present because the body is then using glucose as energy
> 
> 
> and...fat is more easily stored as fat than carbs are, a crazy excess in carbs means that they will be oxidized as energy for a longer period of time (this is so the body can maintain glucose levels) and the use of fat as energy is put on the backburner
> 
> Regardless, carbs shouldn't be feared before bed as long as they are calculated into the metabolic demands of the individuals metabolism


I'd love to hear FG's opinion on this one...

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## Jaakoppi

If your working every day (doing some aerobic job), cycling to work and back like 10-12 miles + train in gym, so what if you eat a bit carbs in evening?

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## bber99

> I'd love to hear FG's opinion on this one...


I don't really see there being much arguement about this? Fats are essential OK, Protein is essential ("essential" is much higher for a bodybuilder on aas), and carbs depend on the metabolic demands of the person.

So once those essential needs of pro/fat are met, then the details matter _less_ so if you want a pro/carb final meal, just calculate it into your daily pro/carb/fat goals.



> If your working every day (doing some aerobic job), cycling to work and back like 10-12 miles + train in gym, so what if you eat a bit carbs in evening?


If I was biking 10-12 miles + the gym I'd be eating carbs all day long (bulking)

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## stevey_6t9

> insulin takes glucose to cells....*it doesn't store fat*.....although fat won't be used as an energy source when insulin is present because the body is then using glucose as energy
> 
> 
> and...fat is more easily stored as fat than carbs are, a crazy excess in carbs means that they will be oxidized as energy for a longer period of time (this is so the body can maintain glucose levels) and the use of fat as energy is put on the backburner
> 
> Regardless, carbs shouldn't be feared before bed as long as they are calculated into the metabolic demands of the individuals metabolism


are you sure?

insulin does increase lipogenesis

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## gbrice75

> I don't really see there being much arguement about this? Fats are essential OK, Protein is essential ("essential" is much higher for a bodybuilder on aas), and carbs depend on the metabolic demands of the person.
> 
> So once those essential needs of pro/fat are met, then the details matter _less_ so if you want a pro/carb final meal, just calculate it into your daily pro/carb/fat goals.
> 
> If I was biking 10-12 miles + the gym I'd be eating carbs all day long (bulking)


I get your point completely, but TDEE/metabolic demand isn't the only piece of the puzzle. Meal and macro timing is essential IMO. I have seen people eat below TDEE in an effort to burn bodyfat, and actually get fatter. Explain that?

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## collar

grapes before bed, not such a good idea and not the best choice by no means..

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