# FITNESS and NUTRITION FORUM > WORKOUT AND TRAINING >  Training arms twice a week to bring them up?

## Stevin85

Good day guys,

I've had a problem with my arms always lagging. No matter what I've tried in the past they always seem to grow slowly.  :Hmmmm:  :Frown: 

So I've been thinking of doing this. 

Training them twice a week. 

My current split is as follows. 
Mon: Shoulders & Tri's
Tues: Legs
Wed: Back and Bi's 
Thurs: Chest

I was thinking of throwing in an arm day on sat. 

Currently I just hit 3-4 sets after my shoulder and back workout on the arms with around 8-10 reps. 

I was thinking on arm day of going heavier and only doing 6 reps or so (especially on tri's) 3 exercises per muscle group of 4 sets.

Might add, that I'm currently on 3rd week of straight Test e, 300mg per week.

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## BTK

I used to do chest and tri's and back and bi's. Now I just do 15 sets for back on back day and 15 sets for chest on chest day and have an arm day where I switch up, super set, and concentrate just on bi's and tri's and my arms got a lot bigger really quick. Since tri's are already secondary on shoulder day and chest day for me and bi's secondary on back day, adding arm day really blew my arms up.

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## Stevin85

My current back and chest workout is 12 sets. 

Shoulders:
4x8 Seated DB Shouler Press
4x8 Upright Row
4x10 Arnold Press

4x8 Skull Crushers

Back:
4x4,6,8,8 Deadlifts
4x8 Lap Pull Down
4x6 DB Rows

3x10 Wide Grip EZ-Curls
2x12 Hammer Curls

Chest: 
4x8 DB Press
4x8 Incline DB Press
4x8 Cable Cross Overs

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## graeme87

> I used to do chest and tri's and back and bi's. Now I just do 15 sets for back on back day and 15 sets for chest on chest day and have an arm day where I switch up, super set, and concentrate just on bi's and tri's and my arms got a lot bigger really quick. Since tri's are already secondary on shoulder day and chest day for me and bi's secondary on back day, adding arm day really blew my arms up.


Same for me!

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## bmit

It seems kind of meaningless when people post how many sets they do without some indication of how many of those are to failure, total failure, or past failure. I mean someone could do nine sets for chest all to total failure and be training 2x as much as someone doing 18 sets with only 4 failure. you know??

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## Stevin85

I usually do all my sets till failure. For chest and back. Arms I usually stop a few reps short of failure.

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## wheelkicktotheface2

supplementation always matters when your training a muscle group more than once a week. you need proper supplementation i suggest at a minimum on top of what your doing to take atleast a creatine supplement and a good pure glutamine supplement 12g per day. protein intake and diet are also huge when it comes to training a body part twice a week. the 300mg of test your on will help but not if your only taking in say 100g protein a day and 1200 calories. BTK is right if your worried about size dedicate a arm day instead of piggy backing them with chest or back. remember to get good full size it takes strength to lift heavier weights. if you want a more detailed explanation need more info on diet, supplementation then we can figure out more.

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## Stevin85

I honestly haven't been counting calories all that much, as I'm bulking. What I make sure of is that I get in 150g a day from shakes. Then at least another 100g from whole foods if not more. I'm not really eating junk food, but I am still indulging on the not so clean stuff. At a guess I would say I'm taking in between 3000-4000 calories a day depending on what I feel like eating. 

My supplements. I only take a Multivitamin and Glutamin (before, and after training). I also take a supplement called Essentiale which is for liver support but I've only been taking it while on I've been on as a recommendation from a friend. 

Strangely though in the month I've been on. I've picked up 3kg (7lbs) in weight but lost 1.5% body fat. So now I'm sitting at 13%. 

I started at 82kg (180lbs) and I'm now up to 85kg (187lbs).

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## wheelkicktotheface2

thats not bad at all . i suggest a creatine supplement daily. pills are easier if ur lazy and dont like the powder. which i dont. take in a gallon to a gallon and a half of water a day along with the creatine and you create a hydroponic growth state in your body where your muscle tissue is completely saturated in your body's fluids which contain the protein creatine glutamine vitamins etc.. the indulging should not hurt anything. unless ur doing amatuer body building shows .. who cares if you pop a twinkie or eat some ice cream on occassion. you may feel bloated at first but after a week or so your body will naturally eliminate that feeling and excess bloating water. ur diet sounds pretty solid. i would dedicate one day to arms. 16-20 sets for biceps and same for triceps. the last set or two of each workout should be till failure. i would suggest 4-5 exercises 4x8-10 on each. you could do this work out twice a week but i would try once a week for two weeks and i bet you will notice a difference. remember hit the protein within 60-90 mins of ending ur workout because your muscles are more open to absorb and make use of it at that point to get maximum results from your workouts. nice gains by the way.

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## wheelkicktotheface2

correction..... the last set or two of each exercise should be till failure

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## graeme87

> thats not bad at all . i suggest a creatine supplement daily. pills are easier if ur lazy and dont like the powder. which i dont. take in a gallon to a gallon and a half of water a day along with the creatine and you create a hydroponic growth state in your body where your muscle tissue is completely saturated in your body's fluids which contain the protein creatine glutamine vitamins etc.. the indulging should not hurt anything. unless ur doing amatuer body building shows .. who cares if you pop a twinkie or eat some ice cream on occassion. you may feel bloated at first but after a week or so your body will naturally eliminate that feeling and excess bloating water. ur diet sounds pretty solid. i would dedicate one day to arms. 16-20 sets for biceps and same for triceps. the last set or two of each workout should be till failure. i would suggest 4-5 exercises 4x8-10 on each. you could do this work out twice a week but i would try once a week for two weeks and i bet you will notice a difference. remember hit the protein within 60-90 mins of ending ur workout because your muscles are more open to absorb and make use of it at that point to get maximum results from your workouts. nice gains by the way.


16-20 sets for biceps and the same for triceps so 32-40 sets in that workout? That is a HUGE amount of volume! How long does it take you to complete that workout? 

I use 5-8 sets each for my biceps and triceps. That's 10-16 sets in the workout and I'll super set them together with 2 mins rest between sets so my workout last 30-45 mins.

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## wheelkicktotheface2

:Wink/Grin:  i suggest 16 sets per body part . i take no more than a 30-60 second break in between each set. im shooting for 8 reps per set. it takes me about 60 mins to do this work out roughly. it helped put about 2 inches on my arms in 3 months. of course i was supplementing heavy as well.

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## Slyder

Another option you could try is working bis with chest and tris with back.

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## graeme87

> i suggest 16 sets per body part . i take no more than a 30-60 second break in between each set. im shooting for 8 reps per set. it takes me about 60 mins to do this work out roughly. it helped put about 2 inches on my arms in 3 months. of course i was supplementing heavy as well.


16 sets with 30 seconds rest? You can't be going very heavy if you're only taking 30 seconds rest.

And 2 inches on your arms in 3 months? That's some crazy gains, what were your stats before and after the 3 months? Age, training experience, height, weight, body fat% etc.
And what were you taking?

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## yerrr

pshh I work every body part twice a week and I'm cutting right now and not even on a cycle...

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## wheelkicktotheface2

i said 30-60 im closer to the 60 mark every time =) 29 , training correctly for 7 years, been training for 10. im 5'10" 205 18% ... CREATINE, GLUTAMINE, FURAZADROL, NE2, ORGANIC VITAMIN SUPPLEMENT, JAY ROB PROTEIN. JUST BECAUSE it doesnt have all the fake crap in it. and 1.5 gallons of water a day. im also Nasm certified. so i have a lil help on that end. my cardio is pretty solid 2 so i prefer to take a lesser break in sets to really get a nasty pump. im not always right or anything but i like my work outs =) obviously everyones body responds differently.

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## graeme87

I don't mean to be rude but if you are saying you gained 2 inches on your arms in 3 months that means you had to gain about 20lbs in body mass maybe more. That means 3 months ago your stats would have been more like 185lbs and with 7 years training at 18% bodyfat I'd have to say you are not doing things correctly.

Also gaining 2 inches (about 20lbs or more in over all body mass) in 3 months is excellent results for someone on a heavy steroid cycle and you did it using supplements?

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## BigBuck6

> i said 30-60 im closer to the 60 mark every time =) 29 , training correctly for 7 years, been training for 10. im 5'10" 205 18% ... CREATINE, GLUTAMINE, FURAZADROL, NE2, ORGANIC VITAMIN SUPPLEMENT, JAY ROB PROTEIN. JUST BECAUSE it doesnt have all the fake crap in it. and 1.5 gallons of water a day. im also Nasm certified. so i have a lil help on that end. my cardio is pretty solid 2 so i prefer to take a lesser break in sets to really get a nasty pump. im not always right or anything but i like my work outs =) obviously everyones body responds differently.


I agree that it is very doubtful that you put 2inches on your arms in 3 months using just supplements without a cycle unless you are new to the game perhaps and have amazing genetic potential. *However, it does not seem that way considering you have been training for 7 years and are "nasm certified" and still @ 18% bodyfat.* Additionally, all those supplements you are throwing into your body are more than likely causing water retention. Creatine especially will cause this and in high doses causes the muscles cells to stretch and swell temporarily with water, one of the mechanisms by which it works.

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## BJJ

Work them out together once a week.
In this way, mine grew up a lot.

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## graeme87

> I agree that it is very doubtful that you put 2inches on your arms in 3 months using just supplements without a cycle unless you are new to the game perhaps and have amazing genetic potential. *However, it does not seem that way considering you have been training for 7 years and are "nasm certified" and still @ 18% bodyfat.* Additionally, all those supplements you are throwing into your body are more than likely causing water retention. Creatine especially will cause this and in high doses causes the muscles cells to stretch and swell temporarily with water, one of the mechanisms by which it works.


Exactly!

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## wheelkicktotheface2

i never said i put on 2 inches of solid ripped hardcore lean gains =) . and i have been out of the gym for about 3 1/2 years =) so yes my genetics are quite good i used to be about 238 6% i stand with no shoes at a smidge under 5'10" and do some local amatuer shows. i put on roughly 16 pounds and the exact gains were 2 1/8 inches on my arms. so i guess it was a little misleading because i used to be much bigger and more lean. it wasnt newly aquired gains just my body simply kicking in the old muscle memory. It is possible i have cycled before yes  :Frown: . some of it was water retention obviously from the creatine as well. sorry if it was misstated it wasnt a 2 1/2 inches of lean solid mass. it was 2 1/8 exact and some water retention im sure.  :BbAily:

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## NVR2BIG1

Your going about it all wrong, its the typical more is better approach and unfortunately unless your arms are a great genetic part it probably wont help. I'd go about it the other way, train them less. Thats just me though

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## wheelkicktotheface2

your saying train them once a week? what kind of results have you had with your current arm workout? i usually only do them once a week or so. they grow more. i just like doing 16-20 sets on arm day. what kind of sets / reps do u prefer. i was just saying if he was set on twice a week make sure he supplements and eats properly so they dont fall off  :7up:

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## wheelkicktotheface2

your saying train them once a week? what kind of results have you had with your current arm workout? i usually only do them once a week or so. they grow more. i just like doing 16-20 sets on arm day. what kind of sets / reps do u prefer. i was just saying if he was set on twice a week make sure he supplements and eats properly so they dont fall off  :7up:  i never said more was better :Wink/Grin:

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## graeme87

You went from 238lbs at 6% to 205 at 18%? That's more that 55lbs of lean muscle lost. 
Even with muscle memory kicking in those are still some crazy gains especially since you have cycled before and now you are training naturally with supplements. 

I'm curious if you are doing 16-20 sets when you are off cycle what sort of volume do you do on cycle? 

From a bodybuilding point of view training each muscle once a week is standard. You don't grow in the gym the body needs time to rest and recover. Sometimes I don't even train my arms depending on how hard it hit my back and chest. 

When you do train arm remember they are a small muscle group and don't need more than 6 sets imo.

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## wheelkicktotheface2

if im doing a cycle which i never would but if i did =) . i usually hit everything twice a week and do less sets and heavier weight. i go for more of a medium between strength and size though. i also eat 5000 cal + a day on cycle .. or would if i did do a cycle. which i dont. obviously.

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## BigBuck6

To put on those types of gains 5k calories just does not seem to cut it. Granted I am bigger than you but to see serious gains I must consume over 7500 calories per day to see stretch marks. Yes, that does include some bodyfat in there but not much, i cannot see how that little can yield such results either. In some research i did for my university athletes needed to bring in around 22 calories per pound times whatever body weight you want to be at. The system works, and your math doesn't in my opinion you would stay too lean with that diet, especially with cardio thrown in and the advent of increased muscle mass. Your results show body fat gain though, am i misinterpreting something?

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## RoadToRecovery

Holy misinformation batman. 

This thread is filled with people who have absolutely no Idea what they are talking about. Where the hell do I start? 




> correction..... the last set or two of each exercise should be till failure


 


> It seems kind of meaningless when people post how many sets they do without some indication of how many of those are to failure, total failure, or past failure. I mean someone could do nine sets for chest all to total failure and be training 2x as much as someone doing 18 sets with only 4 failure. you know??


Some cases it is goal specific, but other then that every time should be to failure




> *supplementation always matters* when your training a muscle group more than once a week. you need proper supplementation i suggest at a minimum on top of what your doing to take atleast a creatine supplement and a good pure glutamine supplement 12g per day. protein intake and diet are also huge when it comes to training a body part twice a week. the 300mg of test your on will help but not if your only taking in say 100g protein a day and 1200 calories. BTK is right if your worried about size dedicate a arm day instead of piggy backing them with chest or back. remember to get good full size it takes strength to lift heavier weights. if you want a more detailed explanation need more info on diet, supplementation then we can figure out more.


The bold is correct. Everything else is not. 




> I honestly haven't been counting calories all that much, as I'm bulking. What I make sure of is that I get in 150g a day from shakes. Then at least another 100g from whole foods if not more. I'm not really eating junk food, but I am still indulging on the not so clean stuff. At a guess I would say I'm taking in between 3000-4000 calories a day depending on what I feel like eating.





> My supplements. I only take a Multivitamin and Glutamin (before, and after training). I also take a supplement called Essentiale which is for liver support but I've only been taking it while on I've been on as a recommendation from a friend.
> 
> Strangely though in the month I've been on. I've picked up 3kg (7lbs) in weight but lost 1.5% body fat. So now I'm sitting at 13%.
> 
> I started at 82kg (180lbs) and I'm now up to 85kg (187lbs).


You do not know how to eat properly. 




> thats not bad at all . i suggest a creatine supplement daily. pills are easier if ur lazy and dont like the powder. which i dont. take in a gallon to a gallon and a half of water a day along with the creatine and you create a hydroponic growth state in your body where your muscle tissue is completely saturated in your body's fluids which contain the protein creatine glutamine vitamins etc.. the indulging should not hurt anything. unless ur doing amatuer body building shows .. who cares if you pop a twinkie or eat some ice cream on occassion. you may feel bloated at first but after a week or so your body will naturally eliminate that feeling and excess bloating water. ur diet sounds pretty solid. i would dedicate one day to arms. 16-20 sets for biceps and same for triceps. the last set or two of each workout should be till failure. i would suggest 4-5 exercises 4x8-10 on each. you could do this work out twice a week but i would try once a week for two weeks and i bet you will notice a difference. remember hit the protein within 60-90 mins of ending ur workout because your muscles are more open to absorb and make use of it at that point to get maximum results from your workouts. nice gains by the way.


You just never cease to amaze me. If you are truly nasm certified, this is sheer proof that ANYONE can be certified. Hydroponic state? 




> I don't mean to be rude but if you are saying you gained 2 inches on your arms in 3 months that means you had to gain about 20lbs in body mass maybe more. That means 3 months ago your stats would have been more like 185lbs and with 7 years training at 18% bodyfat I'd have to say you are not doing things correctly.
> 
> Also gaining 2 inches (about 20lbs or more in over all body mass) in 3 months is excellent results for someone on a heavy steroid cycle and you did it using supplements?


Oh gawd. First of all, when does body composition have anything to do with knowledge. And second of all, where did you get that 2 inches on your arms = 20lbs of muscle. You draw conclusions with out any information, its bizarre. 




> i said 30-60 im closer to the 60 mark every time =) 29 , training correctly for 7 years, been training for 10. im 5'10" 205 18% ... CREATINE, GLUTAMINE, FURAZADROL, NE2, ORGANIC VITAMIN SUPPLEMENT, JAY ROB PROTEIN. JUST BECAUSE it doesnt have all the fake crap in it. and 1.5 gallons of water a day. im also Nasm certified. so i have a lil help on that end. my cardio is pretty solid 2 so i prefer to take a lesser break in sets to really get a nasty pump. im not always right or anything but i like my work outs =) obviously everyones body responds differently.


Did you just post in my Back to the basics thread and just decide to not read it?




> Your going about it all wrong, its the typical more is better approach and unfortunately unless your arms are a great genetic part it probably wont help. I'd go about it the other way, train them less. Thats just me though


This is probably the only semi-solid piece of advice in this entire thread. 




> To put on those types of gains 5k calories just does not seem to cut it. Granted I am bigger than you but to see serious gains I must consume over 7500 calories per day to see stretch marks. Yes, that does include some bodyfat in there but not much, i cannot see how that little can yield such results either. In some research i did for my university athletes needed to bring in around 22 calories per pound times whatever body weight you want to be at. The system works, and your math doesn't in my opinion you would stay too lean with that diet, especially with cardio thrown in and the advent of increased muscle mass. Your results show body fat gain though, am i misinterpreting something?


Id love to read this research that _you_ did for your University. Its to general and generic. Thats to say that someone who is 200lbs with 10% bf and someone who is 200lbs with 20%bf would consume the same because the weighed the same. Negative. 

OP - read my thread and see if that helps you. http://forums.steroid.com/showthread.php?t=427731

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## wheelkicktotheface2

> You just never cease to amaze me. If you are truly nasm certified, this is sheer proof that ANYONE can be certified. Hydroponic state? 
> 
> 
> 
> [/url]


and an NASM certification isnt that damn easy to get  :AaSport19: 

what i was saying is just an easy and creative way for people to hear something and get the idea they need to saturate their body with water. instead of drink water. no one listens. be creative. everyone understands hydroponic because of marijuana and it sounds super nifty. not everyone has the education or knowledge you do rtr or understands a scientific explanation. i guarantee when u talked about atp,glyoclytic,oxidative 1 out of 10 or less people honestly and entirely understood that. i have always found creative ways to explain things to my clients as most of them dont give 2 pisses about the science behind it as long as it yields results. im sure 2/3's of the people here dont either they just want a quick fix or answer to thier question/problem and bang out the results. Yes you sound knowledgeable probably more so than me but i know my shiat as well. :BbAily: 
but anyways im tired of posting in response . you win..there. yay!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydroponics so everyone can see the definition. 
please dont inject plant food in to yourself.

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## wheelkicktotheface2

rtr ... one last thing. yes i read your post. did u read mine? apparently not well. I think i stated quite clearly my workouts are not always right but they work for me and i like them. i by no means said everyone should only rest 30-60 secs between each set. just stated thats what i personally do. i also yield results that way for the moment. when i stop getting results ill switch back to trim and proper cookie cutter workouts. so  :BbAily:  but  :Chairshot:

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## RoadToRecovery

The problem is, you dont know your shit. At all. 

You give advice and then get corrected and then give an excuse why you posted incorrect information.




> rtr ... one last thing. yes i read your post. did u read mine? apparently not well.


I read your posts... all of them. And allow me to quote each piece of misinformation that you gave. 




> you create a hydroponic growth state in your body where your muscle tissue is completely saturated in your body's fluids which contain the protein creatine glutamine vitamins etc..


Hydroponics is the method of growing plants without soil. You can still be well hydrated and not grow. The reason why hydration is so important, is because 50-70% of your body is made out of water and would not properly function with out it. In other words, your metabolic processes would be hindered.




> the indulging should not hurt anything. unless ur doing amatuer body building shows .. who cares if you pop a twinkie or eat some ice cream on occassion. you may feel bloated at first but after a week or so your body will naturally eliminate that feeling and excess bloating water.


During a hypertrophy phase, cheating should be practically eliminated. Bloating is caused by a number thingsl; intestinal gases, metabolic water production etc. It should take no more than a day to eliminate bloating. 




> the last set or two of each workout should be till failure.


All sets should be to failure. 




> remember hit the protein within 60-90 mins of ending ur workout because your muscles are more open to absorb and make use of it at that point to get maximum results from your workouts.


Post work out meal should be consumed *immediately* after a workout comprised of a simple carb and protein meal. Studies show that a carb/protein meal immediately after eliminates catabolism and rapidly restores glycogen depleted during a workout. 




> i by no means said everyone should only rest 30-60 secs between each set.


30 second rests in between each set in a hypertrophy phase is a great way to overtrain.

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## wheelkicktotheface2

:Blowingup:  

you keep posting...ill keep training people. You make me tired. As long as my workouts work, i make the gains i do and I know how to avoid over training/injurying myself we wont worry about it anymore..  :BbAily: 

my last post in this thread. cause well its took quite the detour from what it was orginally about. b-bye rtr. *hug*

yes i agree consuming immediately is far superior. but anything after 60-90 minutes is about worthless and no more beneficial than eating a meal. its shown you still get benefits up to 90 mins post workout they are just far lower than consuming immediately.

and i usually take about 60 seconds rest in between each set. its the way i train and i like it. its also why i only do my last 2 sets till failure and not all.

who the hell completely eliminates cheating? everyone loves to be a lil fat on occassion. obviously im a lil fat 18% but still.

most people who arent used to consuming large amounts of water or have not previously usually have an uncomfortable feeling of bloating for 3-7 days. this is what my clients tell me. Everyones body is different so im assuming thats why there is such a spread in the days.. they are also currently consuming 1.5-2gallons of water per day.
you win! yay! *notice* i did not correct or explain anything above. i just restated. *hug*

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## spywizard

Actually you guys.. using a heart rate monitor will tell you when you are ready to start the next set, but that's just science... 

In my own body, (i'm 49 though) my first 3-5 sets (depending on the rep range) I can get my HR to 164 which is when the valsalvic maneuver happens and i am training at 95-100% effort, that is according to my HR... 

If my design and goal is to increase white fiber tissue development (fast twitch) i am in the 4-6 range.. my recovery HR is 100.. during the 1st 3-5 sets it takes about 30 seconds.. however as the session continues it will take me 45 - 50 seconds to recover enough to continue the next set.. 

But hey I'm 208, 5'9 12-14% BF without diet, at 10% bf I'm 203 and don't care to go lower than that.. but like i said.. i'm old. 

By the by, recovery hr for 12-15 reps which develops fast red fibers the recovery rate is 115

20-25 rep range recovery is 125 this is where the most energy is spent and conditions red slow.. 

Thanks, just throwing it out there..

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## spywizard

by the way, i appreciate you guys not resorting to name calling, sarcasm is one thing but thanks for keeping it civil.

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## wheelkicktotheface2

thanks for posting in here ur links to peptides is exactly what i needed! there is tons of information on that link i needed. i was very unsure and uncomfortable about ordering them because of procedures i was not familiar/comfortable/or just didnt know at all.. thanks! Now i can get on with testing these peptides on the rats and seeing what results i can get! i gotta get my diet right first and get back in better shape ....

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## RoadToRecovery

> Actually you guys.. using a heart rate monitor will tell you when you are ready to start the next set, but that's just science... 
> 
> In my own body, (i'm 49 though) my first 3-5 sets (depending on the rep range) I can get my HR to 164 which is when the valsalvic maneuver happens and i am training at 95-100% effort, that is according to my HR... 
> 
> If my design and goal is to increase white fiber tissue development (fast twitch) i am in the 4-6 range.. my recovery HR is 100.. during the 1st 3-5 sets it takes about 30 seconds.. however as the session continues it will take me 45 - 50 seconds to recover enough to continue the next set.. 
> 
> But hey I'm 208, 5'9 12-14% BF without diet, at 10% bf I'm 203 and don't care to go lower than that.. but like i said.. i'm old. 
> 
> By the by, recovery hr for 12-15 reps which develops fast red fibers the recovery rate is 115
> ...



Of course, specificity is important and the HR method is a way to be specific for yourself. But when I give advice on this board, I tend to be a bit broad and general. Its hard to pinpoint specifics with out giving a proper assessment ya know? 

I will say however, that I have clients who's heart rate doesn't budge the entire session so this method isn't reliable for them.

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## RoadToRecovery

> by the way, i appreciate you guys not resorting to name calling, sarcasm is one thing but thanks for keeping it civil.


Being civil is the best way to insult someone lol  :2jk: 

On a serious note, I tend to get a bit perturbed with people on here who give false advice being that it is a pet peeve of mine. Its unecessary for things to get out of control, but I do start getting a little more abrasive if they keep doing it over and over again. **cough* (wheelkick) *cough** lol

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## RoadToRecovery

> you keep posting...ill keep training people. You make me tired. As long as my workouts work, i make the gains i do and I know how to avoid over training/injurying myself we wont worry about it anymore..


 It is your responsibility to know what you are doing in order to *properly* train someone. People dont care where you got your certification. They just care that you know what you are talking about.
You can make gains any way, its not just about gains - Its about overall or optimum results.





> my last post in this thread. cause well its took quite the detour from what it was orginally about. b-bye rtr. *hug*


The thread detoured because you came in here giving advice that was ridiculous and completely altered the flow of the topic.




> yes i agree consuming immediately is far superior. but anything after 60-90 minutes is about worthless and no more beneficial than eating a meal. its shown you still get benefits up to 90 mins post workout they are just far lower than consuming immediately.


So then why wouldnt you say immediately? Your job as a trainer is to give invaluable information. The best information. Not just good info. 




> and i usually take about 60 seconds rest in between each set. its the way i train and i like it. its also why i only do my last 2 sets till failure and not all.


Thats fine if you are not trying to accomplish something and are just looking to work out. But if you have a specific goal like the OP does, then all of this information you posted about you is IRRELEVANT.




> who the hell completely eliminates cheating? everyone loves to be a lil fat on occassion. obviously im a lil fat 18% but still.


 Not many people, which is why you will see countless threads that say "I got alittle out of control with my bulk" or "I did a dirty bulk" etc. And if you notice, i did not say COMPLETELY eliminate. Cheating is acceptable and I advocate cheating to some individuals. But when it comes to hypertrophy, cheating should be given a second thought.




> most people who arent used to consuming large amounts of water or have not previously usually have an uncomfortable feeling of bloating for 3-7 days. this is what my clients tell me. Everyones body is different so im assuming thats why there is such a spread in the days.. they are also currently consuming 1.5-2gallons of water per day.
> you win! yay! *notice* i did not correct or explain anything above. i just restated. *hug*


Most people who are uncomfortable drinking water, are sedentary. If they are inactive and they drink water, then yes bloating will occur. But this had nothing to do with your last post about bloating. You were talking about cheating not drinking water. Ff you have a bottle of water every 3 hours with your meals AND you are properly eating/training... bloating really isnt something to give a concern about.

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## wheelkicktotheface2

sigh... w/e works for you. and false advice? at worst slightly missleading. and its just advice you dont agree with because its not cookie cutter in the exercise science book your commonly referring to during post.  :0piss:  
 :BbAily:  

 :7up:

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## RoadToRecovery

> sigh... w/e works for you. and false advice? at worst slightly missleading. and its just advice you dont agree with because its not cookie cutter in the exercise science book your commonly referring to during post.


Well lets use semantics for a second. You just said:




> false advice? at worst slightly missleading.


Definition of misleading:




> deceptive: designed to deceive or mislead either deliberately or inadvertently


Definition of deceive:




> be false to; be dishonest with


There is no partially false, or partially right. You are either wrong or right.

Now for the cookie cutter comment - 

All advice regarding health and fitness needs to be generalized until you give a full and proper assessment. You know nothing about this individual to give specific advice.

I dont agree with your advice because it is WRONG in its ENTIRETY. You have no educated or well thought out rebuttal, so there for you say my advice is cookie cutter. I didnt know that the basics was considered cookie cutter. Hence why I made the back to the basics thread. 

You told someone in another thread that in order for them to build their endurance they should perform sprints. You are either lying that you are certified, or you just bought the course and havent even tested yet. Because if you are certified with any certifying company/school then you are giving every single well educated trainer a horrible horrible name.

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## wheelkicktotheface2

:Bbiwin:

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## wheelkicktotheface2

and if u dont think you build any type of endurance sprinting, you make me laugh. 
b-bye

even though im guessing you have a ego/im the best super cool guy attitude. i dont think i have seen a single post someone has made you replied in you havent atleast tried to correct someone on something. relax a lil.  :BbAily:  
im done reposting so have fun talking to yourself.  :7up:

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## 100percentbodyfat

i just read through this forum and holy crap. first of all i see a my dick is bigger than your dick contest going on here. wheelkick2theface you are not NASM certified. Im ACSM/NASM certified and have a BA in exercise science. I beleive you have had some type of training or self knowledge but some of the info is silly, some of it is ok. Rtr you know your stuff but you should of dropped it. Don't fuel the fire =). and talk about a serious case of  : Hijack:  
have fun all

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## RoadToRecovery

> i just read through this forum and holy crap. first of all i see a my dick is bigger than your dick contest going on here. wheelkick2theface you are not NASM certified. Im ACSM/NASM certified and have a BA in exercise science. I beleive you have had some type of training or self knowledge but some of the info is silly, some of it is ok. Rtr you know your stuff but you should of dropped it. Don't fuel the fire =). and talk about a serious case of  
> have fun all


This isnt an "i know more than you" type argument. This entire website is filled with individuals seeking information and advice; and individuals who dont know anything about the pertaining topic giving advice. Its all about weeding them out. My whole purpose this entire thread is not to highlight the fact that I am knowledgeable, but to show the people seeking advice to not believe everything that they read. This individual (wheelkick) has posted in several threads preaching false information and claiming he is certified. So there for, people who are looking for advice see "Im certified" and will automatically take that as someone who knows what they are doing. This is a public forum where ideas and information is freely passed on. If you were aware of false information would you not speak up?




> and if u dont think you build any type of endurance sprinting, you make me laugh. 
> b-bye


Lets not oversimplify the argument now. You know damn well what I was referring to. You can build anaerobic endurance and aerobic endurance. The individual was seeking advice to build endurance for an MMA event.




> even though im guessing you have a ego/im the best super cool guy attitude. i dont think i have seen a single post someone has made you replied in you havent atleast tried to correct someone on something. relax a lil.  
> im done reposting so have fun talking to yourself.


Its funny, everyone who comes here and gets chewed out for giving advice about things they know nothing about; make it about them. This is not about you wheel. In fact, its way bigger than you. Stop victimizing yourself. You have no clue about fitness and are in no way capable of giving advice.

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## spywizard

> Of course, specificity is important and the HR method is a way to be specific for yourself. But when I give advice on this board, I tend to be a bit broad and general. Its hard to pinpoint specifics with out giving a proper assessment ya know? 
> 
> I will say however, that I have clients who's heart rate doesn't budge the entire session so this method isn't reliable for them.



yea, I use a HIIT/hybrid routine for "mostly women" with a significant cardio ability, people would be surprised just by adding 5-10 lbs and having them work overhead will take their HR into an effective training zone. 

I have an 84 yr old man on BP meds, over time he as been able to now work up to an exceptable HR, i incorperated stair climbing for him,, Point being, i've been able to train clients that I would not have been successful with had i not had a heart rate monitor on them.

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## 100percentbodyfat

i understand what your saying road. wrong info makes me itchy too. I have always gotten on this site to check about certain types of supplementation. and look in the workout section on occassion. since i got my degree and certifications i figured i would start making a few post and checking things out. good to start posting and yea i understand road someone could take that info and run with it. that would not be to special at all. nothing upsets me more than keeping someone from their goals or causing them injury. Im hoping to go for a masters in the next couple years but i dont know. i think im leaning more to a specialized physical therapy. anyone know any good readings for biomechanics ? thanks guys. good to be here !

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## graeme87

So to answer the original question, training arms twice a week is not a good idea to bring them up. 

Once a week is enough, some people don't even both training arms as going heavy on back day hits the biceps well and going heavy on chest hits the triceps. Although I do recommend some direct arm work. 

There is some very bad advice in this thread i.e. training arms twice a week with 16-20 sets! I would do that much volume for my arms once a week when on a heavy cycle.

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## RoadToRecovery

More specifically, change your arm workout entirely. You could be nearing a plateau

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