# FITNESS and NUTRITION FORUM > **CONFIDENTIAL** BLOOD TESTING and 5 Day STEROID CLEANSE! >  Liver Values: High AST??

## Slide

I just got some blood work back (pre cycle). Everything checked out great except my AST. All other liver values were normal...

Bilirubin - 0.8 (0.1-1.2)
Alk. Phosph - 60 (25-150)
AST - 67 (0-40) *High*
ALT - 54 (0-55) *Very close to high*

Any idea on the cause? here is what i am taking:
Avodart 2.5mg ED
Chromium 200mg ED
Multi-vitamin x2 ED
Novla 20mg ED

I wanted to throw some VAR in with my next cycle, would that be a really bad idea with these liver numbers?

thanks

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## sizerp

I am also wondering the same thing - my AST was about 60 too. Which is not normal the nurse said...

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## Slide

So i have done a bit of digging and it looks like we have raised values but heavey exercise and lifting can cause elevated values (into the low hundreds). Tylenol can also cause values raised to my level. That said i have not taken tylenol for months.

The consensus is that it is not something to really worry about until they get to 3-4 times the normal level. so that would be 180+

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## Slide

I am surprised i have not gotten more info on this from the people here...

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## sizerp

Slide - I have also come to the same conclusion about the elevated levels in AST, afer some reading, *Thanks to Merc for his write-up.

I do have a Dr. appt. on Friday morning, to discuss everything. Let you know how it goes.

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## Slide

Thanks Sizerp. please update this thread when you have info from you doctor. 

I am starting some Var, milk thisle and Liv 52. In a few weeks i will get my blood run again and see how angry my liver is...

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## sizerp

Spoke to the Dr. today - he didn't have much to say. Just asked me some questions and said he wanted to re-check my liver values in 6 weeks.

Aside from that my bloodwork showed:

Estradiol: 39 (13-54 pg/mL) high?
Test: 681 (250-1100 ng/dL)
Test (free): 149.8 (35.0-155.0 pg/mL)
(%): 2.20 (1.50-2.20 %)
FSH: 3.4 ( 1.6-8.0 mIU/mL)
LH: 7.6 (1.5-9.3 mIU/mL)
TSH, 3RD GENERATION: 3.92 (.40-4.50 mIU/mL) high?

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## Slide

all the rest of you blood work looks good. That is a good test number if you hare not on gear. If the estrogen gets any higher then i would think about some Adex, but right now it seems okay.

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## sizerp

Thanks Slide - how long would you administer the Adex for? What doses?

Also, any thoughts on the TSH levels?

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## sizerp

> Thanks Sizerp. please update this thread when you have info from you doctor. 
> 
> I am starting some Var, milk thisle and Liv 52. In a few weeks i will get my blood run again and see how angry my liver is...


Are you on TRT?

What do you think about this?

Also - do you think I could stack CA with the anti-biotic Minocycline?

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## johnCash

hey do either of you know what liver enzymes are? i just got some blood work done along with a drug screen too and my reading was a 96(either ast or alt) and he said it should be about a 50. i just finished 4 weeks of a dbol kickstart at the time and i was taking a bunch of multi vitamins, milk thistle and others too. my doctor asked if i was drinking alot lately and i said no so he told me to stop taking all pills and suppliments and it should go back to normal. other than that he didnt have much to say but im suppost to get retested in 2-3 months

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## Skinny_Indian

High liver values are usually from orals. Could be a combo of the nolva and avodart. How much fat do you eat everyday? And why would you take 200mg of Chromium? An adult male needs 35-50 ug per day. Notice ug and not mg.

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## TITANIUM

You are well within healthy parameters.Alot of things make liver enzymes fluctuate.But it looks good.

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## Slide

Thanks titan, that is reassuring to know.

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## CHAP

If you truly want to see an acurate liver panel you need to not lift for 5 days. Then take the lab work . 

One of my last cycles was superdrol 40mg and halodrol at 150mg. After cycle I waited a month to get the bood work done . And did not lift the week before the test. 

Everything came back normal. 

All the blood work in the past was boarder line high . And I believe it was due to not letting my liver have time to flush before the bloodwork waas done.

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## sizerp

Good to know gents. I am getting re-tested at the end of August. We'll see if anything changes. I was thinking of taking Liv 52 or milk thistle or something to help rejuvinate things until then. Will keep you posted.

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## Slide

I started taking both liv52 and milk thistle, I have only read good things about them. Liv52 is actually a legitimate pharmaceutical in the Netherlands or something.

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## sizerp

> I started taking both liv52 and milk thistle, I have only read good things about them. Liv52 is actually a legitimate pharmaceutical in the Netherlands or something.


Interesting... Do you drink Milk Thistle tea? or pop some caps? I hear the tea is good.

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## OldPLer

I had blood work done because of injury when i was on test/tren cycle and liver enzymes were high, after being off cycle for 6 weeks all tests came back normal. I was not drinking much and no orals, think mine was caused by the tren.

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## sizerp

Welp, tomorrow morning around 9am I am getting my blood tested again. I should get the results back within the week. Also, I haven't lifted in about a week and a half, so we'll see if anything changes.

The only other changes since my last testing (couple months ago) have been diet, environment, and training routine. No AAS or drinking since then. Kee you posted.

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## BJJ

> I just got some blood work back (pre cycle). Everything checked out great except my AST. All other liver values were normal...
> 
> Bilirubin - 0.8 (0.1-1.2)
> Alk. Phosph - 60 (25-150)
> AST - 67 (0-40) *High*
> ALT - 54 (0-55) *Very close to high*
> 
> Any idea on the cause? here is what i am taking:
> Avodart 2.5mg ED
> ...


Have you ever heard about Gilbert's syndrome?
Many has it but ignore it.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gilbert%27s_syndrome

Those blood exams are not completed. Where are the bilir. direct and indirect?

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## sizerp

> Have you ever heard about Gilbert's syndrome?
> Many has it but ignore it.
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gilbert%27s_syndrome
> 
> Those blood exams are not completed. Where are the bilir. direct and indirect?


Many have GS? Your article proclaims only about 5% of people have it. Sounds kinda rare, and I doubt that's the case. Interesting, nontheless.

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## BJJ

> Many have GS? Your article proclaims only about 5% of people have it. Sounds kinda rare, and I doubt that's the case. Interesting, nontheless.


Man, 5% of people seem less to you?
Make a simple calculation, it's a lot!

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## sizerp

> Man, 5% of people seem less to you?
> Make a simple calculation, it's a lot!


Well 5% of 6 billion people is many... but 5% itself is relatively small.

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## sizerp

BTW how can you even test for GS? What do I ask my Dr.? That Wikipedia article is shady.

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## BJJ

You have to name it, and he will go through your liver with more exams like bilir. dir. and indr. A sign of it is to have the dir. one very high, like the double of what one should have.
In any case, no worry about since it is harmless but since we all stress our liver with lots of proteins, it is good to know if one has it. Don't you think?

A sign of it could be yellow eyes.

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## sizerp

> You have to name it, and he will go through your liver with more exams like bilir. dir. and indr. A sign of it is to have the dir. one very high, like the double of what one should have.
> In any case, no worry about since it is harmless but since we all stress our liver with lots of proteins, it is good to know if one has it. Don't you think?
> 
> A sign of it could be yellow eyes.


Thanks for the info. Yes I will mention it this morning when I go to my Dr. for bloodwork in a couple hours.

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## BJJ

good luck

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## sizerp

> good luck


Yar! TY  :Big Grin:

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## sizerp

Well - I recieved my blood results for liver enzymes only:

2 Months ago my levels were something like

AST - 61 (0-40) *High*
ALT - 50 (0-55)

Recent results as of this week... (No lifting for 1.5 weeks before blood draw)

AST - 20 (0-40)
ALT - 18 (0-55)

Everything is back to normal. I seriously think that lifting induced the elevated enzyme levels a couple months back.

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## BJJ

> Well - I recieved my blood results for liver enzymes only:
> 
> 2 Months ago my levels were something like
> 
> AST - 61 (0-40) *High*
> ALT - 50 (0-55)
> 
> Recent results as of this week... (No lifting for 1.5 weeks before blood draw)
> 
> ...


Next time I advise you to insert also the CPK-MM exam which is the best info you can obtain regarding the elevation of some enzymes induced by lifting.

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## BJJ

By the way, what about the Gilbert...?

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## sizerp

Thanks BJJ -

I will ask to niclude that in the next exam, what exactly is it?

Also, about the GS... Well my Dr. I need to find a new one because he didn't even pop in to say hi to me. The nurse shrugged off any questions I had in regards to the blood drawing. Next Dr. I find I'll inqcuire.

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## BJJ

> Thanks BJJ -
> 
> I will ask to niclude that in the next exam, what exactly is it?
> 
> Also, about the GS... Well my Dr. I need to find a new one because he didn't even pop in to say hi to me. The nurse shrugged off any questions I had in regards to the blood drawing. Next Dr. I find I'll inqcuire.


The CPK blood test is a laboratory test that measures creatine phosphokinase (CPK), which is one of the enzymes found in the brain, heart, and skeletal muscles. This is a useful test for helping doctors to diagnose problems such as muscle damage, heart attack, and related conditions.
When the CPK level in the blood is very high, it often means there has been injury or stress to the heart, skeletal muscle tissue, or even the brain. This is because CPK leaks into the bloodstream whenever this type of damage occurs. This test may be used to identify heart attack; determine the cause of chest pain; determine the level of muscle damage present; detect some conditions early; and give information about a patient's muscular dystrophy status. Gradual elevations in the level of CPK in the blood can help doctors diagnose serious conditions.
There are many conditions that can cause the results of a CPK blood test to be abnormal. These conditions include inflammation of the muscle of the heart, stroke, inflammation of the skeletal muscles, muscular dystrophy, death of muscular tissue, and convulsions. Other conditions, such as hypothyroidism, can also cause abnormal CPK blood test results, as well as hard lifting.

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## Slide

Here are my most recent values. They are elevated b/c of Var and Halo...

AST - 101
ALT - 77

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## sizerp

> Here are my most recent values. They are elevated b/c of Var and Halo...
> 
> AST - 101
> ALT - 77


That isn't too bad considering you're stacking 2 orals.

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## sizerp

> The CPK blood test is a laboratory test that measures creatine phosphokinase (CPK), which is one of the enzymes found in the brain, heart, and skeletal muscles. This is a useful test for helping doctors to diagnose problems such as muscle damage, heart attack, and related conditions.
> When the CPK level in the blood is very high, it often means there has been injury or stress to the heart, skeletal muscle tissue, or even the brain. This is because CPK leaks into the bloodstream whenever this type of damage occurs. This test may be used to identify heart attack; determine the cause of chest pain; determine the level of muscle damage present; detect some conditions early; and give information about a patient's muscular dystrophy status. Gradual elevations in the level of CPK in the blood can help doctors diagnose serious conditions.
> There are many conditions that can cause the results of a CPK blood test to be abnormal. These conditions include inflammation of the muscle of the heart, stroke, inflammation of the skeletal muscles, muscular dystrophy, death of muscular tissue, and convulsions. Other conditions, such as hypothyroidism, can also cause abnormal CPK blood test results, as well as hard lifting.


Very interesting. I will ask about it for sure now. My TSH levels tip the upper part of the scale, however I don't think it's hyper.

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## Slide

So i found this really interesting. I was watching that movie Supersize Me again. In one scene he is in the docs office and if you pause it you can see his liver values...

AST - 187
ALT - 528!

i was amazed. People talk about how bad steroids are...they are nothing compared to McDonalds! haha. His cholesterol also shot up to 230 from 160 something. 

Keep in mind this is after just 3 weeks of his McDiet.

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## BJJ

No wonder to me, that food can kill you.

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## DuckCommander

> Here are my most recent values. They are elevated b/c of Var and Halo...
> 
> AST - 101
> ALT - 77


Go to my thread regarding liver enzyme values from a pro. Read it, then ask questions.

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## 07sandiegomuscle

Sizerp, are you in the USA? How much did the blood test cost?

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## Big

> Sizerp, are you in the USA? How much did the blood test cost?


sizerp has been banned for some time now, he won't answer. that's why it says "banned" under his name.

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## Copied21

That is a good test number if you hare not on gear. If the estrogen gets any higher then i would think about some Adex, but right now it seems okay.

Regards

Copied

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dossier surendettement

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