# MEMBERS EXPERIENCES > OVER 40 FORUM >  Self-medicating TRT

## 40plusnewbie

I'm 43, have avg. test levels for my age. Have read up on the bennies of trt and hrt and am interested in this in the future when I am older. I have a question about test dosages though. If I were to self-administer say, 400mg of test cyp per week instead of a lower dose that is typically prescribed, are there risks involved that are not an issue at 250mg/week (or whatever the standard dose is)? When I go on trt in my 50's or 60's I'd prefer to be on a higher dose of test than what is typically prescribed. Would I be opening myself up to problems I would not encounter if taking the standard trt dose?

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## Spartans09

That is a massive dose for trt. It would be considered a cycle at 400mg/wk. 100-150mg/wk is more in line with traditional trt. The idea is to get your blood levels consistently into the upper 1/3 of the range for total test and free test while at the same time keeping estrogen at a reasonable level. In a nutshell you want to have the hormone balance of a normal 21 year old. 
At the dose you were mentioning you are looking for all kinds of trouble both in the relatively short term and long term.

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## dec11

250 would be the very upper levels of trt, 400 is cycle dosage

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## Times Roman

trt is a big commitment, and usually for the average bloke, reserved for someone older... 40+ or so. Many here that are younger go on trt due to earlier cycle experience, and the body slowly begins to not respond to pct.... first, the standard medical dose for test cyp is 200mg eow. You are 4x that over standard. So you are in error. You are not discussing trt, you are really discussing a permenant cycle, which anyone here will tell you is bad for you. Your RBC will shoot through the roof, which is why so many here have to donate blood to reduce that. Are you prepared to potentially have to give blood every 6 weeks or so?
My 200mg eow puts my test levels at actual 181.9 range 35.0-155.0 pg/mL . As you can clearly see, I am well beyond the upper limits of the standard range. In fact, my doc wants me to reduce my dosage by 20%

but now look at this:
HGB 18.3 13.0-17.0 g/dL 
HEMATOCRIT 53.8 39.0-51.0 % 
normally, they are not this high, and indicates too much RBC and hemoglobin...

let me tell you something... these blokes in here that cycle test at high amounts, they do so for short periods of time.... typically 8 to 12 weeks. and then they PCT for the same amount of time.... what you are suggesting is a permenant cycle without giving your body any rest.

What you are suggesting is very bad imho. If you want to go permenant cycle, then go with the standard dose of 200mg eow or 100mg ew depending on how much you like to stick yourself. Then after a few months, you will go do some more blood work, and you will make adjustments to your dose... maybe a little bit higher, or in my case, a little bit lower.

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## marcus300

400mgs isnt HRT, thats a cycle. A normal HRT dose (depends which country) is around 125-150mgs weekly

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## dec11

> trt is a big commitment, and usually for the average bloke, reserved for someone older... 40+ or so. Many here that are younger go on trt due to earlier cycle experience, and the body slowly begins to not respond to pct.... first, the standard medical dose for test cyp is 200mg eow. You are 4x that over standard. So you are in error. You are not discussing trt, you are really discussing a permenant cycle, which anyone here will tell you is bad for you. Your RBC will shoot through the roof, which is why so many here have to donate blood to reduce that. Are you prepared to potentially have to give blood every 6 weeks or so?
> My 200mg eow puts my test levels at actual 181.9 range 35.0-155.0 pg/mL . As you can clearly see, I am well beyond the upper limits of the standard range. In fact, my doc wants me to *reduce my dosage* by 20%
> 
> but now look at this:
> HGB 18.3 13.0-17.0 g/dL 
> HEMATOCRIT 53.8 39.0-51.0 % 
> normally, they are not this high, and indicates too much RBC and hemoglobin...
> 
> let me tell you something... these blokes in here that cycle test at high amounts, they do so for short periods of time.... typically 8 to 12 weeks. and then they PCT for the same amount of time.... what you are suggesting is a permenant cycle without giving your body any rest.
> ...


i am also going to reduce mine soon after my nxt blast cycle, and have bloods done to see where im at, health has to be considered

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## 40plusnewbie

Thanks for the responses guys. That answers my questions. I'm not looking to jam myself up. Right now I do cycles and plan to continue that until I hit my goals with what I want my physique to be at. 

A follow-up: When I"m in my 50's/60's, assuming my test levels are not that of a young man I am going to want to do trt to get my test levels to where a young man's are at. I'll also likely use small doses of hgh (right now i'm doing cjc/ghrp-2). Say I'm doing hrt at 150/200mg week or whatever dose puts me with test levels of that of a healthy young man, is there a problem with upping your test doses and adding in another compound for say 8 weeks or so to basically do a cycle to put on some extra mass? And how do you do pct if at all? There must be guys who are on trt and also cycle, is there any pct involved or does one use or keep on hand as a precaution an AI and that's it or what? How do you get your hormones back in balance if you run a cycle while on trt?

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## Times Roman

cruising (trt dose rates) and blasting (cyle dose rates) can be done, but is even more risky than just a cycle dose rate. Why? You still never really give your body a break. I'll advisable unless you are taking your blood panels regularly. But the blasts should be far and few between, because, after all, you are now getting older. At what point in an engines life do you thow on a turbo-charger? When it is high or low mileage? You can put it on anytime is the reality, but you increase the risk of throwing a rod or a valve the more mileage you have on the engine. 

Up to you mate... it's your engine!

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## 40plusnewbie

> cruising (trt dose rates) and blasting (cyle dose rates) can be done, but is even more risky than just a cycle dose rate. Why? You still never really give your body a break. I'll advisable unless you are taking your blood panels regularly. But the blasts should be far and few between, because, after all, you are now getting older. At what point in an engines life do you thow on a turbo-charger? When it is high or low mileage? You can put it on anytime is the reality, but you increase the risk of throwing a rod or a valve the more mileage you have on the engine. 
> 
> Up to you mate... it's your engine!


Thanks Times Roman, this makes a lot of sense. I probably won't have much of a need to blast in my 50's and 60's if I'm on trt, especially since I plan on taking hgh, albeit in low doses. Thanks for explaining this to me.

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## LeanGreenMachine

Good advice Times...

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## Bullseye Forever

it will cause problems at 400mg/week,i was taking 600mg/10 days for trt precribed dose from endo,which basically is a cycle and ive gotten myself in a mess,with out of this world high estrogen levels,im now having to fix this problem,not fun i feel worse now than i did before i started trt 4 years ago,ive dropped my trt dose to 200mg/week on my own,not by my endo,and going to stay at that dose,until i start running my cycles,endos will get you in trouble if you dont watch it,they just give you a sricp and go with it,and they really dont care,i found out the hard way,im 44 and i feel like im 90 right now and have no interest in life at all,but thats fixin to change

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## turk1968

ive been on trt for about 2 years and have managed to drop my dosage from 250mg to 150 mg. I take this dose of test e every week even if on cycle. By this i mean that even if running a short cycle of test p and tren a for 6 weeks at high doasges i know that when i stop my cycle i have no worries about crashing etc because the underlying long estered test is still there. I rarerly use long test now as i prefer shorter cycles . At 250mg is still sort of felt on cycle if that makes sense, i do loose a bit of strength and size at 150mg but that goes back on in the first week or so of cycle but i always feel good when i come off cycle and at 49 years old still want to play with the wife of many many years every night! ( if she would let me !!!! )

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## Vettester

Listen to guys like Bullseye, who can share these real life experiences! TRT is a GREAT thing, it's a 2nd chance, a new lease on life ... The list goes on. However, if not medicated responsibly it can soon become your enemy. I'm running an increased blast for 10 weeks, BUT then it's back to the normal dosage protocol of 150mg; maybe less depending on my HCG dosage at the time. My body will be plenty stressed by the end of the 10 weeks, I couldn't imagine the long-term negative effects it would have if I just kept running at that rate. 

Know your body, have a plan, and run frequent labs - 2x year minimum, 4x preferably.

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## The Hyena

I have a question, lets say you have test cyp at 200mg per ml
and your injection frequency is mon morning and thursday night, 
HOW do you make 150mgs a week ??

I could do a 1/2cc mon and thur but that makes 200mg's right ???

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## Far from massive

While I absolutely agree that dosing test above physiologic ranges is unhealthy with a ton of bad effects.


I would say that blasting and cruising is not as much harder (*may actually be less harmful*) on the body than doing cycles.

This is because if you are taking the correct dose of Test for your TRT then blasting and cruising is basically the same as doing cycles as far as test levels go. Think about it most parts of the body do not really care if the test is endogenous or exogenous as long as the levels are the same. So with this in mind think about someone doing cycles, after a cycle they have to (should) take PCT drugs which have a lot of negative effects to speed the bodies readjustment of test production and a return to hemostasis, conversely after a blast all one needs to do is adjust test and AI levels if needed to balance out Test and Estro. 

Just food for thought.

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## Far from massive

> I have a question, lets say you have test cyp at 200mg per ml
> and your injection frequency is mon morning and thursday night, 
> HOW do you make 150mgs a week ??
> 
> I could do a 1/2cc mon and thur but that makes 200mg's right ???



How bout .30ml Monday since its 72 hrs till next injection and .45 Thursday since its 96 hrs till next injection ?

PS My calculator,pen and paper is in the other room so this is all in my head so if my math is off feel free to correct me.

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## Bullseye Forever

> Listen to guys like Bullseye, who can share these real life experiences! TRT is a GREAT thing, it's a 2nd chance, a new lease on life ... The list goes on. However, if not medicated responsibly it can soon become your enemy. I'm running an increased blast for 10 weeks, BUT then it's back to the normal dosage protocol of 150mg; maybe less depending on my HCG dosage at the time. My body will be plenty stressed by the end of the 10 weeks, I couldn't imagine the long-term negative effects it would have if I just kept running at that rate. 
> 
> Know your body, have a plan, and run frequent labs - 2x year minimum, 4x preferably.


thanks vetteman08,i have recently gotten 2 more appts with 2 different endos not in the city i live in but in Memphis Tn,and both are well respected endo's,so im going to one on june 17th and the other in October to ask for a 2nd and third opinion,my first endo has lied and talked out of both sides of his mouth,he called last week and told me to change my dose to 150mg eevery 10 days,since i told him my estrogen was so high,and i asked him why it was high and he said,well it was to much testosterone ,and i said well you presricbed me that dose and informed me that at that dose"clinical"dose it would raise estrogen,that proves he doesnt know what he's talking about,so im still at 200mg every week until i found out some more info

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## Far from massive

Bullseye, 

This whole thing is really amazing to me,
To place someone on TRT and not monitor blood values, particularly at such a high dosage where it should be done frequently and repetitively is completely irresponsible. For an Endo or any kind of medical practitioner to neglect this is clearly malpractice. I am completely blown away that they had you on this high a dosage and were not addressing the changes in blood chemistry that were bound to occur.
By the way my apologies for not asking you about this in all the PM’s we have exchanged. I noticed your messages getting more and more “emotional” over the months and even commented to a friend that it seemed like you were suffering from high estro, but since I knew you were on medical TRT I knew that estro was not the cause, despite all the clear indications to the contrary. Well live and learn.

Anyway glad to hear you have found out what your problem is and again my apologies for not bringing the change in your messages and their possible cause to your attention.

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