# GENERAL FORUM > IN THE NEWS >  McCain chooses Sarah Palin for VP

## Ernst

John McCain has chosen Alaska Governor Sarah Palin (a 44 year-old female) as his running mate according to a senior campaign official. What are your thoughts on this?

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## BgMc31

Although I'm an Obama supporter, I think this is a great pick by McCain. It shores up the neoconservative base, it appeals to those white women that who were Clinton supporters and were on the fence about McCain and Obama, and it shows that the republican party is willing to show some diversification and not just the party of white men. But she is very inexperienced, has young children (including a 3mos old downs kid), and is currently under investigation for attempting to fire someone without just cause (I believe it was her brother-in-law).

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## Carlos_E

> Although I'm an Obama supporter, I think this is a great pick by McCain. It shores up the neoconservative base, it appeals to those white women that who were Clinton supporters and were on the fence about McCain and Obama, and it shows that the republican party is willing to show some diversification and not just the party of white men. But she is very inexperienced, has young children (including a 3mos old downs kid), and is currently under investigation for attempting to fire someone without just cause (I believe it was her brother-in-law).


Doubtful. The Hillary supports don't want a woman. They want Hillary. If you check out the comments on feminist blogs they consider the pick as an insult. They clearly see it as pandering for their votes. Also this under cuts McCain's attack on Obama being too young and inexperienced. Palin has been a governor for a year and a half and before that a mayor of a small town. She's two years younger than Obama and has less experience. With McCain's age and having cancer 3 times, his VP should be a serious pick, not a token. Political blogs are calling her Geraldine Quayle. (A token with no experience.)

"She's embroiled in a Troopergate scandal of her own, with state investigators looking at serious allegations that Palin abused her office by pressuring the state Public Safety Commissioner to fire "an Alaska state trooper involved in a rough divorce from Palin's sister. (Abuse of power!) After the firing that got her administration into trouble, Palin replaced him with another guy who'd recently been hit with a credible sexual harassment accusation. Palin later admitted that she knew about the complaint in advance but denied that she knew of the letter of reprimand he'd received. He lasted two weeks on the job."

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6UojMnCgqVA

"Republicans have been heavily touting Sarah Palin's reformist credentials, with her supposed opposition to Alaska's "Bridge to Nowhere" as Exhibit A. But how hard did she really fight the project? Not very, it seems. Here's what she told the Anchorage Daily News on October 22, 2006, during the race for the governor's seat (via Nexis):

*5. Would you continue state funding for the proposed Knik Arm and Gravina Island bridges?


Her response:*

Yes. I would like to see Alaska's infrastructure projects built sooner rather than later. The window is now--while our congressional delegation is in a strong position to assist."

Palin is pro life. She stated that women who are victims of rape and incest should be required to bring their pregnancies to term.

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## BgMc31

Leave it to the homie Carlos to set me straight! hahahahaha! No pun intended 'Los.

Yo, you comin out to Vegas for the Olympia, brotha?

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## Carlos_E

McCain's VP pick dissed the job only a month ago:

In an interview just a month ago, she dissed the job, saying it didn't seem "productive."

In fact, she said she didn't know what the vice president does.

Larry Kudlow of CNBC's "Kudlow & Co." asked her about the possibility of becoming McCain's ticket mate.

Palin replied: *"As for that VP talk all the time, I'll tell you, I still can't answer that question until somebody answers for me what is it exactly that the VP does every day?* I'm used to being very productive and working real hard in an administration. We want to make sure that that VP slot would be a fruitful type of position, especially for Alaskans and for the things that we're trying to accomplish up here for the rest of the U.S., before I can even start addressing that question."

 :LOL: 

*Palin On Iraq*

She "heard" about the surge

Alaska Business Monthly: We've lost a lot of Alaska's military members to the war in Iraq. How do you feel about sending more troops into battle, as President Bush is suggesting?

Palin: *I've been so focused on state government, I haven't really focused much on the war in Iraq. I heard on the news about the new deployments,* and while I support our president, Condoleezza Rice and the administration, I want to know that we have an exit plan in place; I want assurances that we are doing all we can to keep our troops safe. Every life lost is such a tragedy. I am very, very proud of the troops we have in Alaska, those fighting overseas for our freedoms, and the families here who are making so many sacrifices.

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## Carlos_E

> Yo, you comin out to Vegas for the Olympia, brotha?


Still debating if I'll go. I started contest prep. I have two shows coming up.

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## Flagg

I heard this on the radio today.

Apparantly she is the Governor of Alaska, used to be a former Beauty Queen pagent, has 3 or 5 kids, cant remember which, is staunch anti-abortion and apparantly has less political experience than Obama. 

I dont know nowhere near as much about American politics as you guys do, but that kinda seems like a bad choice for McCain. Was he hoping to try and take some of the Hillary support away from Obama?

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## thegodfather

You guys go ahead and vote for one of the two establishment candidates that were picked for you by the corporate media...


I'll vote for Bob Barr, someone who believes in REAL American principals...and not a neo-conservative or a Socialist in disguise. Socialism is all the rage these days it would seem...

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## Coop77

Hottest VP candidate ever.

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## Voice of Reason

Q: "How are your qualifications on foreign policy?" - Journalist

A: "I believe I am very qualified cause Alaska is right next to Russia." - Sarah Palin

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## BITTAPART2

> You guys go ahead and vote for one of the two establishment candidates that were picked for you by the corporate media...
> 
> 
> I'll vote for Bob Barr, someone who believes in REAL American principals...and not a neo-conservative or a Socialist in disguise. Socialism is all the rage these days it would seem...


why be that guy bro? Id vote for Barr too if the media let him be a candidate but they didnt so we are FORCE again to pick the lesser of the two evils. We should at least do it right this time, it comes down to Obama and McCain period, we cannot have another 4 years of Bush policies that have screwed us beyond all belief. And it would be refreshing to me to have a candidate in office that actually knows what is is like to not be brought up with a silver spoon in his mouth. Bob Barr is the man, no doubt, but I cant waste my vote bro, we cant have McCain in office

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## Carlos_E

Even Locals Are Blasting Palin Pick

*An editorial in the Fairbanks Daily News-Miner:
*
She has never publicly demonstrated the kind of interest, much less expertise, in federal issues and foreign affairs that should mark a candidate for the second-highest office in the land. Republicans rightfully have criticized the Democratic nominee, Sen. Barack Obama, for his lack of experience, but Palin is a neophyte in comparison; how will Republicans reconcile the criticism of Obama with the obligatory cheering for Palin?...Most people would acknowledge that, regardless of her charm and good intentions, Palin is not ready for the top job. McCain seems to have put his political interests ahead of the nation's when he created the possibility that she might fill it. It's clear that McCain picked Palin for reasons of image, not substance.

*The Anchorage Daily News samples some state politician reaction:
*
"She's not prepared to be governor. How can she be prepared to be vice president or president? said [State Senate President Lyda Green, a Republican from Palin's hometown of Wasilla]. "Look at what she's done to this state. What would she do to the nation?"

*The News-Miner again, in round-up local reaction story:*

Lately her reputation within the state has been bit by allegations of mixing political and family business, and by mistreating one of the state's premier marine mammals. Palin's catch-phrase of "openness and transparency" has been tarnished by revelations that staff members tried to have Palin's former brother-in-law fired from his job as an Alaska state trooper. Also, the governor of the only state with polar bears has adamantly opposed listing the animals as a threatened species, despite strong evidence that global warming has devastated their sea ice environment off Alaska's coast. Dermot Cole, a longtime columnist for Alaska's second largest newspaper, the Fairbanks Daily News-Miner, called McCain's choice of Palin "reckless" and questioned her credentials. "Sarah Palin's chief qualification for being elected governor was that she was not Frank Murkowski," Cole said of her enormously unpopular predecessor, who lost favor with Alaskans in part because of unpopular budget cuts. "She was not elected because she was a conservative. She was not elected because of her grasp of issues or because of her track record as the mayor of Wasilla."

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## Flagg

I hope McCain wasn't dumb enough to select her in an attempt to "seduce" America into picking him.

McCain is what, 72 now? Theres a good chance the guy will croak within 10 years time, now I have nothing against a woman being President, but would you want THIS WOMAN to be President? Your President and leader of the Free World? I wonder if she's thought about this, she has five kids, pretty big family, and she's prepared to just put them to one side for times in National Security and Duty?

I hope instead of seeing an attractive woman, America see's what it would be like for the next ten years under someone like her. 

Sorry, I dont know much about Obamas pick, maybe comparing the two will make up the minds of the people.

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## thegodfather

> I hope McCain wasn't dumb enough to select her in an attempt to "seduce" America into picking him.
> 
> McCain is what, 72 now? Theres a good chance the guy will croak within 10 years time, now I have nothing against a woman being President, but would you want THIS WOMAN to be President? Your President and leader of the Free World? I wonder if she's thought about this, she has five kids, pretty big family, and she's prepared to just put them to one side for times in National Security and Duty?
> 
> I hope instead of seeing an attractive woman, America see's what it would be like for the next ten years under someone like her. 
> 
> Sorry, I dont know much about Obamas pick, maybe comparing the two will make up the minds of the people.


You will get the SAME result with either candidates. 

McCain voted to give telecom criminals immunity, Obama voted to give telecom criminals immunty!

McCain voted for the Patriot Act, Obama voted for the Patriot Act!

McCain believes in "neutralizing" the Iranian threat, Obama believes in "neutralizing" the Iranian threat!

McCain believes in pre-emptive warfare, Obama believes in pre-emptive warfare!

McCain believes in BIG GOVERNMENT, Obama believes in BIG GOVERNMENT!


Does not matter which candidate you choose...You will get more of the same with either one. Neither candidate respects the Constitution of the United States, and I suspect that many of the people voting for them don't respect the Constitution of the United States either.

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## Flagg

Godfather, prehaps another way of looking at things is judging it on which VP you would like most in charge. McCain is old and there is a very good chance he could die during his term in office, that would leave Sarah McCain in charge. I don't know much about Obamas choice, but Sarah McCain would not fill me with confidence if I was an American citizen. I _have_ done some research on her and nothing there much lights my fire. 

Or prehaps you should vote for who is less likely to piss you off more. The fact remains, you only have two options for who you want in charge. Again, I dont know much about Bob Barr, but voting for him is a complete waste and will only assuage your conscience.

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## Tesla

> Hottest VP candidate ever.



I'd hit it!!!

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## j4ever41

Obama running as a candidate for change and picks Biden for his VP haha.

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## Carlos_E

> Although I'm an Obama supporter, I think this is a great pick by McCain. It shores up the neoconservative base, it appeals to those white women that who were Clinton supporters and were on the fence about McCain and Obama


*Surprise? First Two National Polls Find Palin Gains LESS Support from Women 
*
NEW YORK The first national polls on John McCain's pick of Sarah Palin yesterday came out today from Rasmussen and Gallup -- and contrary to what the GOP probably hoped, she scored less well with women than men. 

Here's a finding from Gallup: Among Democratic women -- including those who may be disappointed that Hillary Clinton did not win the Democratic nomination -- 9% say Palin makes them more likely to support McCain, 15% less likely.

From Rasmussen: Some 38% of men said they were more likely to vote for McCain now, but only 32% of women. By a narrow 41% to 35% margin, men said she was not ready to be president -- but women soundly rejected her, 48% to 25%. 

Only 9% of Obama supporters said they might be more likely to vote for McCain. 

Overall, voters expressed a favorable impression of her by a 53/26 margin, but there was a severe gender gap on this: Men embraced her at 58% to 23%, while for women it was 48/30.

And by a 29/44 margin, men and women together, they do not believe that she is ready to be President. 

As for voters not affiliated with either major party, 37% are more likely to vote for McCain and 28% less likely to do so.

Gallup is now out with its own initial poll. It also shows women with a slightly less favorable view of Palin. An excerpt from USA Today:

There is wide uncertainty about whether she's qualified to be president. In the poll, taken Friday, 39% say she is ready to serve as president if needed, 33% say she isn't and 29% have no opinion.

That's the lowest vote of confidence in a running mate since the elder George Bush chose then-Indiana senator Dan Quayle to join his ticket in 1988. In comparison, Delaware Sen. Joe Biden was seen as qualified by 57%-18% after Democrat Barack Obama chose him as a running mate last week.....

Among all those surveyed, 35% call Obama's speech at Invesco Field at Mile High Stadium Thursday night excellent, 23% good, 15% "just OK," 3% poor and 4% "terrible." Sixteen percent say they didn't see it and 14% have no opinion. That's higher than the ratings for acceptance speeches by President Bush and Democrat John Kerry in 2004, by Bush and Democrat Al Gore in 2000 and by Republican Bob Dole in 1996.

Asked about the Democratic convention's impact, 43% say it makes them more likely to vote for Obama, 29% less likely. Nineteen percent say it won't make a difference.

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## MuscleScience

I am not sure about her political stance, but any women that can have 5 kids and be in that good of shape at her age gets my vote.

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## thegodfather

Those polls are as reliable as the weatherman...

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## Voice of Reason

No matter who you vote for, all the president's and all their agendas have already been chosen ahead of time for you, at the Bohemian Grove ever since Dwight D. Eisenhower.

 :Tear:

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## Voice of Reason

> Those polls are as reliable as the weatherman...


You say weatherman, coincidence...? = http://blog.washingtonpost.com/fact-...onnection.html


...

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## Roidal

> Hottest VP candidate ever.


She's hot, is she really 44? or is she on some GH?

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## DeputyLoneWolf

> No matter who you vote for, all the president's and all their agendas have already been chosen ahead of time for you, at the Bohemian Grove ever since Dwight D. Eisenhower.



Very true and for people who do not believe this just do some research. There are some conspiracy theories that are very plausible.

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## DeputyLoneWolf

> *Surprise? First Two National Polls Find Palin Gains LESS Support from Women 
> *
> NEW YORK The first national polls on John McCain's pick of Sarah Palin yesterday came out today from Rasmussen and Gallup -- and contrary to what the GOP probably hoped, she scored less well with women than men. 
> 
> Here's a finding from Gallup: Among Democratic women -- including those who may be disappointed that Hillary Clinton did not win the Democratic nomination -- 9% say Palin makes them more likely to support McCain, 15% less likely.
> 
> From Rasmussen: Some 38% of men said they were more likely to vote for McCain now, but only 32% of women. By a narrow 41% to 35% margin, men said she was not ready to be president -- but women soundly rejected her, 48% to 25%. 
> 
> Only 9% of Obama supporters said they might be more likely to vote for McCain. 
> ...



Well Carlos, its sure funny how you are so quick to jump into this thread when you got the one locked about me asking you what you thought about Obama's choice in Biden. I sent you a pm asking what you thought like you said I should, but for some odd reason I have yet to receive a reply...

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## Coop77



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## BgMc31

Godfather how do you rectify Bob Barr's extreme support of the impeachment of Bill Clinton and the Libertarian platform that bs like that has no barring on the real issues that were plaguing Americans then.

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## DeputyLoneWolf

> 



Theres also a video of her shooting a M-16 at a range. I bet that has the democrats crapping their pants. She's also a lifetime NRA member  :Wink/Grin:

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## Carlos_E

*So much for abstinence-only education
*
The 17-year-old daughter of Republican vice presidential candidate Sarah Palin is pregnant, Palin said on Monday in an announcement intended to knock down rumors by liberal bloggers that Palin faked her own pregnancy to cover up for her child.

Bristol Palin, one of Alaska Gov. Palin's five children with her husband, Todd, is about five months pregnant and is going to keep the child and marry the father, the Palins said in a statement released by the campaign of Republican presidential candidate John McCain.

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## Carlos_E

*The Palin Meltdown in Slo-Mo
By Greg Sargent - September 1, 2008, 6:20PM*

On the same day that the Republicans were forced to dramatically cut back their convention activities, the Palin Meltdown unfolded with extraordinary speed. It's worth pondering the totality of what happened today, in a mere half day...

* The news that Palin once backed the Bridge to Nowhere went national.

* It emerged that Palin has links to the bizarro Alaska Independence Party, which harbors the goal of seceding from the union that McCain and Palin seek to lead.

* The news broke that as governor, Palin relied on an earmark system she now opposes. Taken along with the Bridge to Nowhere stuff, this threatens to undercut her reformist image, something that was key to her selection as McCain's Veep candidate.

* The news broke that Palin's 17-year-old daughter became pregnant out of wedlock at a time when the conservative base had finally started rallying behind McCain's candidacy.

* Barely moments after McCain advisers put out word that McCain had known of Bristol Palin's pregnancy, the Anchorage Daily News revealed that Palin's own spokesperson hadn't known about it only two days ago.

* A senior McCain adviser at the Republican convention was forced into the rather embarrassing position of arguing that McCain had known about the pregnancy "last week" -- without saying what day last week he knew about it.

* It came out that Republican lawyers are up in Alaska vetting Palin -- now, more than 72 hours after it was announced that she'd been picked.

* Palin lawyered up in relation to the trooper-gate probe in Alaska -- a move that ensures far more serious attention to the story from the major news orgs.

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## Carlos_E

Ouch!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UYYiw_y2qDI&eurl

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## j4ever41

The 17-year-old daughter of Republican vice presidential candidate Sarah Palin is pregnant.

SO WHAT.

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## Carlos_E

It's a big deal when Repubs. run on family values and Palin is only for abstinence education. Maybe if her daughter received proper sex education and the use of condoms she wouldn't be pregnant! Yeah, that abstinence education obviously works!

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## Carlos_E

If this was Michelle and Barack Obama's 17 year old daughter think of the reaction. "Another Black teenage unwed mother!" It would be all over the news questioning the Obama's family values and if they're like the rest of us. 

Palin's back ground sounds like McCain found her on the set of Jerry Springer.

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## Carlos_E

*The Palin Meltdown in Slo-Mo
By Greg Sargent - September 1, 2008, 6:20PM*

On the same day that the Republicans were forced to dramatically cut back their convention activities, the Palin Meltdown unfolded with extraordinary speed. It's worth pondering the totality of what happened today, in a mere half day...

* The news that Palin once backed the Bridge to Nowhere went national.

* It emerged that Palin has links to the bizarro Alaska Independence Party, which harbors the goal of seceding from the union that McCain and Palin seek to lead.

* The news broke that as governor, Palin relied on an earmark system she now opposes. Taken along with the Bridge to Nowhere stuff, this threatens to undercut her reformist image, something that was key to her selection as McCain's Veep candidate.

* The news broke that Palin's 17-year-old daughter became pregnant out of wedlock at a time when the conservative base had finally started rallying behind McCain's candidacy.

* Barely moments after McCain advisers put out word that McCain had known of Bristol Palin's pregnancy, the Anchorage Daily News revealed that Palin's own spokesperson hadn't known about it only two days ago.

* A senior McCain adviser at the Republican convention was forced into the rather embarrassing position of arguing that McCain had known about the pregnancy "last week" -- without saying what day last week he knew about it.

* It came out that Republican lawyers are up in Alaska vetting Palin -- now, more than 72 hours after it was announced that she'd been picked.

* Palin lawyered up in relation to the trooper-gate probe in Alaska -- a move that ensures far more serious attention to the story from the major news orgs.

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## BgMc31

> Theres also a video of her shooting a M-16 at a range. I bet that has the democrats crapping their pants. She's also a lifetime NRA member


Why would the Dems crap in their pants because the broad can fire a M-16? Is this something Dems should be scared of? Is so, why?

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## j4ever41

I am sure there are plenty of girls that have had sex education classes and have gotten pegnant, anyone that steps up and tries to make this some kind of an issue is a fool and will only hurt Obama.

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## Ernst

Seriously, who was not getting laid by seventeen? Leave the poor girl alone.

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## DeputyLoneWolf

> Why would the Dems crap in their pants because the broad can fire a M-16? Is this something Dems should be scared of? Is so, why?



Because they are so anti gun. Why don't you try thinking for a change?

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## DeputyLoneWolf

> I am sure there are plenty of girls that have had sex education classes and have gotten pegnant, anyone that steps up and tries to make this some kind of an issue is a fool and will only hurt Obama.


Exactly. Ahem Carlos... :1welcome:

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## DeputyLoneWolf

> Obama running as a candidate for change and picks Biden for his VP haha.



I know, and Carlos still refuses to tell me if he's still supporting Obama... lol

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## BITTAPART2

umm I think carlos is supporting Obama. palin would get a creamed out mug from me and thats about it, not my vote. But still cant wait until the Maxim comes out after her and the old bag lose the presidential race. damn that pic of her with the gun gave me wood QUICK like, cialis last night may have helped that. _Bitta goes to rub one out_

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## BgMc31

> Because they are so anti gun. Why don't you try thinking for a change?


I know that thinking is an entirely new concept for you deputydumbdumb (now I see how you obtained that name!). Being pro gun control is not the same as being anti-gun. Learn how to think for yourself and stop being brainwashed by Rush, Levin, and Hannity!

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## Carlos_E

TPM Election Central adds a few more bits like the fact that Palin "relied on an earmark system she now opposes", as well as supporting the Bridge to Nowhere before the funding was cut. Which, of course, means that when she said "I told Congress, 'Thanks, but no thanks,' on that bridge to nowhere," she wasn't exactly telling the truth.

And besides all that, she was a Director of Ted Stevens' 527 corporation, and hired his former chief of staff as a lobbyist for Wasilla. (Question: why does such a small town need a lobbyist? "Of 149 incorporated places in Alaska, just six of them had paid registered lobbyists in 2002, including Wasilla, lobbying records show.")

*Of these stories, Palin's past membership in the Alaskan Independence Party seems the most damaging to me. The Party's Introduction page has this quote from its founder:

"I'm an Alaskan, not an American. I've got no use for America or her damned institutions."
Its goal has its own separate page:

"The Alaskan Independence Party's goal is the vote we were entitled to in 1958, one choice from among the following four alternatives:
1) Remain a Territory.
2) Become a separate and Independent Nation.
3) Accept Commonwealth status.
4) Become a State.
*
The call for this vote is in furtherance of the dream of the Alaskan Independence Party's founding father, Joe Vogler, that Alaskans achieve independence under a minimal government, fully responsive to the people, and promoting a peaceful and lawful means of resolving differences."

Here's its platform, and here are its statements on issues. Among its positions are the reclamation of all federal land through homesteading, the abolition of all property taxes, the prohibition of all bureaucratic regulations not expressly passed by the legislature, "the right of jurors to judge the law as well as the facts," and a host of other things. But their main goal is the vote on independence mentioned above, which should be "a true plebecite according to international law, only legal Alaskan citizens, it is in the language of the people, federal military and their dependants are not legal citizens and will not be allowed to vote in this plebescite." (So much for the right of military personnel to register to vote where they live, like the rest of us. Although since they don't spell out who counts as a "legal Alaskan citizen", maybe the rest of us wouldn't have the right to vote in the plebiscite either.)

On the Party's website, there's an article by Joe Vogler explaining what he thinks was wrong with the original vote by which Alaskans chose statehood. I got about halfway through it and became unable to read carefully (it's long, and not well-written.) If anyone makes it through, please feel free to correct the provisional opinion that follows. That said: as far as I can tell, this is one of those articles that voluble cranks write when they encounter something that sets them off. Documents are adduced, footnotes proliferate, there is every appearance of monstrous erudition, and yet the whole thing makes no sense. Reading it reminded me of the time I was at a survivalist convention (don't even ask), and someone tried to explain to me, in excruciating detail, why the entire income tax was illegitimate.

This is a nutty organization. It is, moreover, an organization whose founder took his views, and the Party's, to imply that he was not an American.

The McCain campaign has been more than willing to question Obama's patriotism on the basis of nothing at all. Yet when asked about Sarah Palin's past membership in a secessionist party, "a McCain spokesperson did not respond to a request for comment."

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## 39+1

I always vote for the best looking girl that way i dont get disappointed

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## xlxBigSexyxlx

Palin is in no way, ready to run this country

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## DeputyLoneWolf

> TPM Election Central adds a few more bits like the fact that Palin "relied on an earmark system she now opposes", as well as supporting the Bridge to Nowhere before the funding was cut. Which, of course, means that when she said "I told Congress, 'Thanks, but no thanks,' on that bridge to nowhere," she wasn't exactly telling the truth.
> 
> And besides all that, she was a Director of Ted Stevens' 527 corporation, and hired his former chief of staff as a lobbyist for Wasilla. (Question: why does such a small town need a lobbyist? "Of 149 incorporated places in Alaska, just six of them had paid registered lobbyists in 2002, including Wasilla, lobbying records show.")
> 
> *Of these stories, Palin's past membership in the Alaskan Independence Party seems the most damaging to me. The Party's Introduction page has this quote from its founder:
> 
> "I'm an Alaskan, not an American. I've got no use for America or her damned institutions."
> Its goal has its own separate page:
> 
> ...



^^Lol "Mr. Cut and Paste" strikes again.

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## DeputyLoneWolf

> I know that thinking is an entirely new concept for you deputydumbdumb (now I see how you obtained that name!). Being pro gun control is not the same as being anti-gun. Learn how to think for yourself and stop being brainwashed by Rush, Levin, and Hannity!



I don't listen to them at all. And I think for myself. Thats like me assuming you listen to Louis Farrakan and Jerimiah Wright. You just prove over and over that you are just mad at the world and feel that this country owes you a living, healthcare and also needs to pay for your children to go to college.

People like YOU need to do some real thinking for yourselves before we end up with a president (Obama) that refuese to put his hand over his heart or even wear an american flag. Wathc this and tell me what you think. And before you go on and on I too feel they spent too much time on his name of wich I could care less. 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8yMn96ACAtg

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## Dizz28

Mccain just gave the presidency to Obama. No matter who you support, you have to agree on that. All Mccain has had to say about obama is ho he is inexperienced to run the country but yet he picks someone as his VP (who very well might have to take office soon...) that has much much less experience poilitically and leadership wise.

This was political pandering at it's peak

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## BgMc31

> I don't listen to them at all. And I think for myself. Thats like me assuming you listen to Louis Farrakan and Jerimiah Wright. You just prove over and over that you are just mad at the world and feel that this country owes you a living, healthcare and also needs to pay for your children to go to college.
> 
> People like YOU need to do some real thinking for yourselves before we end up with a president (Obama) that refuese to put his hand over his heart or even wear an american flag. Wathc this and tell me what you think. And before you go on and on I too feel they spent too much time on his name of wich I could care less. 
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8yMn96ACAtg


Dude your level of ignorance is truly withouts limits! The fact that you actually believe Barack 'refuses' to wear the American flag or put his hand over his heart shows how simple minded and easily brainwashed you are. Both falsehoods have been debunked numerous times and this has been acknowledged by even Hannity, Levin, and Savage. For every pic u produce of Obama without that lapel pin I can produce an equal number if not more of McCain, Bush, Clinton and every other major politician without one as well.

And lastly, if you, again, had the ability of reading comprehension you would have read that I don't 'expect' the richest country in the world to pay for college or healthcare but merely to make it 'available'. Typical of an neoconservative, right winger to attempt to skew an obvious point.

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## Red Ketchup

Found that this morning... made me smile...



Though I agree that the kid does not belong in the public eye, one cannot fail to notice that her unwed underage pregnancy is the direct result of her mothers anti-sex-ed and pro-abstinance position...

Red

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## Carlos_E

> Dude your level of ignorance is truly withouts limits!


Now you see why I don't bother to reply to him.

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## DeputyLoneWolf

> Now you see why I don't bother to reply to him.


No you just cannot debate.

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## xlxBigSexyxlx

Screwed either way.

Republicans (Nazis): jihadists, wiretapping, terror, war, national id, torture

Democrats (Soviet Union): free healthcare, social security, war, welfare

Ron Paul (We The People): Uphold the constitution

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## MuscleScience

> Screwed either way.
> 
> Republicans (Nazis): jihadists, wiretapping, terror, war, national id, torture
> 
> Democrats (Soviet Union): free healthcare, social security, war, welfare
> 
> Ron Paul (We The People): Uphold the constitution


nice!!!!!!

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## Voice of Reason

I believe we are all too stupid and too smart for are own good, unwilling to make any real change ourselves and depending on these people we see on a T.V. to help us. Cause of all the vices given to us through our lives by this country I doubt anyone is willing to sacrifice for the better good of humanity. My point your all fvcking pussies and need to be willing to kill and die to make any real change in this world. Bitches...

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## Voice of Reason

Or... let's just nature take it's course maybe these Elitist really know whats good for the betterment of mankind, of course a few million lives will be lost to a New World Order, 1 government, 1 Planet Earth United sounds good who knows??? 
It may be nice, just hope I'm not one to die for the utopia...

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## Carlos_E

> No you just cannot debate.


Yes I can. I don't care to entertain your stupidity made apparent by ANSWER MY THREAD! ANSWER MY THREAD! You're like a child having a tantrum to get my attention. Well, you just got it and you're not getting any more.

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## 39+1

Who ever is the best looking is who you should vote for.

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## DeputyLoneWolf

> Yes I can. I don't care to entertain your stupidity made apparent by ANSWER MY THREAD! ANSWER MY THREAD! You're like a child having a tantrum to get my attention. Well, you just got it and you're not getting any more.



Lol this proves my point, what a simple mind.

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## DeputyLoneWolf

> Screwed either way.
> 
> Republicans (Nazis): jihadists, wiretapping, terror, war, national id, torture
> 
> Democrats (Soviet Union): free healthcare, social security, war, welfare
> 
> Ron Paul (We The People): Uphold the constitution


Ron Paul would have got my vote if he had a chance.

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## DeputyLoneWolf

> Dude your level of ignorance is truly withouts limits! The fact that you actually believe Barack 'refuses' to wear the American flag or put his hand over his heart shows how simple minded and easily brainwashed you are. Both falsehoods have been debunked numerous times and this has been acknowledged by even Hannity, Levin, and Savage. For every pic u produce of Obama without that lapel pin I can produce an equal number if not more of McCain, Bush, Clinton and every other major politician without one as well.
> 
> And lastly, if you, again, had the ability of reading comprehension you would have read that I don't 'expect' the richest country in the world to pay for college or healthcare but merely to make it 'available'. Typical of an neoconservative, right winger to attempt to skew an obvious point.


Ok let's get into some real issues shall we? I stand that Obama is ashamed to be American and his actions prove it. He has gone to a out of control racist church for the last 20years and still supports Jerimaiah Wright. That guy is a racist if I have ever seen one. Saying things like "Barack knows what it's like to grow up in a country controlled by rich white people!!!" from his pulpit during a sermon. And what about his church giving a life achievment award to Louis Farrakan? A man who believes that white people where created by a nutty black scientist? I really hate racists both white and black. It's people like that that keep all these issues in the limelight. Oh, and what about Obama's Campaign office in Texas having a Cuban flag on the wall with the likeness of the communist mass murderer, Che Guevara, on it? His campaign denied suporting that or knowing about it but that CLEARLY shows you what kind of people support him. These same people are not what I call real Americans. They have no interest in this country past what it can be made to do for them. I'm sorry but I am an American and stand for the princicples this country what founded and built on. I do not like fake people like Obama because he is a n empty suit and will only use the presidency to furhter his personal agendas. He is an eloquent speaker but thats it. He is not living in the real world, most people aren't these days. Maybe I just have a more clar view of things because I wear boots and a gun to work. 

So BgMc, what is your take on Jerimaih wright and all the surrounding issues?

I am interested to hear.

DLW

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## SMCengineer

> Ron Paul would have got my vote if he had a chance.


You're not voting to pick a winner, you vote your conscience.

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## FallenWyvern

> You're not voting to pick a winner, you vote your conscience.


You should talk to the Floridians that voted for Ralph Nader in 2000 and see if voting with their conscience got them anywhere. I don't think they wanted Bush to win.

Save yourself the time, just don't vote and quit posting about irrelevant president hopefuls. Why not proclaim yourself as a better presidential hopeful. You, me, your neighbor, David Nolen, Ron Paul or Bob Barr could be better presidential hopefuls. 

The relevant conversation is about McCain and Obama. One of the two will be president. Seems like every political post gets wrecked by some upholding the constitution blah blah blah.... 

I think most people are talking about the elections prefer to talk about people that can win. I could give some great talking points about how I would be a better choice. But guess what, who cares? 


Back on topic, I thought at first when I heard about Sarah Palin, I thought McCain was a big dummy. 

She has no experience at all. No business being a heartbeat away from being president yet, none. Horrible choice.

She has more experience than Obama. 

I guess her inexperience glares in the face of Obama, maybe McCain isn't a dummy.

I still don't really get it. I don't know why anybody would vote for McCain. I could if only I disliked Obama more. I will probably not waste any time with voting or making any more posts about politics. 

Not like it matters unless you live in a swing state anyways.

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## BgMc31

> Ok let's get into some real issues shall we? I stand that Obama is ashamed to be American and his actions prove it. He has gone to a out of control racist church for the last 20years and still supports Jerimaiah Wright. That guy is a racist if I have ever seen one. Saying things like "Barack knows what it's like to grow up in a country controlled by rich white people!!!" from his pulpit during a sermon. And what about his church giving a life achievment award to Louis Farrakan? A man who believes that white people where created by a nutty black scientist? I really hate racists both white and black. It's people like that that keep all these issues in the limelight. Oh, and what about Obama's Campaign office in Texas having a Cuban flag on the wall with the likeness of the communist mass murderer, Che Guevara, on it? His campaign denied suporting that or knowing about it but that CLEARLY shows you what kind of people support him. These same people are not what I call real Americans. They have no interest in this country past what it can be made to do for them. I'm sorry but I am an American and stand for the princicples this country what founded and built on. I do not like fake people like Obama because he is a n empty suit and will only use the presidency to furhter his personal agendas. He is an eloquent speaker but thats it. He is not living in the real world, most people aren't these days. Maybe I just have a more clar view of things because I wear boots and a gun to work. 
> 
> So BgMc, what is your take on Jerimaih wright and all the surrounding issues?
> 
> I am interested to hear.
> 
> DLW


Search this site and you will see where I stand on Wright and the other 'surrounding issues' as you call them. The fact that you have proven your ignorance about Trinity Baptist Church, and the fact that you continue to question Obama's patriotism is ridiculous. You've brought up points that have been debunked time and time again but you continue to bring them up. So a debate with you is pointless. You don't listen nor do you, obviously, have the ability to comprehend much beyond your narrow-minded bigotted viewpoints.

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## SMCengineer

> You should talk to the Floridians that voted for Ralph Nader in 2000 and see if voting with their conscience got them anywhere. I don't think they wanted Bush to win.


This is an assine assumption that because they voted for Nader that they would'nt have voted for Bush or would have voted for Gore. When in reallity they didn't vote for either because they _liked_ Nader. However, Bush didn't win because of Nader. He won because he got more support and that's it. 




> Save yourself the time, just don't vote and quit posting about irrelevant president hopefuls. Why not proclaim yourself as a better presidential hopeful. You, me, your neighbor, David Nolen, Ron Paul or Bob Barr could be better presidential hopefuls.


Where exactly did I post about irrelevant presidential hopefuls in this thread? I merely stated that you should vote for who you believe would be best for the spot of POTUS, whether it be a mainstream candidate or a third party candidate. You shouldn't vote based on who you believe will win, which is how most people vote. 



> The relevant conversation is about McCain and Obama. One of the two will be president. Seems like every political post gets wrecked by some upholding the constitution blah blah blah.... 
> 
> I think most people are talking about the elections prefer to talk about people that can win. I could give some great talking points about how I would be a better choice. But guess what, who cares?


So you'd rather talk about how Palin's daughter is pregnant and how it's a "cover-up" for her supposed son Trig? Or would you rather talk about how much Obama's wife "hates America" and how he doesn't wear a flag pin? This is what's "relevant" in the elections today and if you'd like to talk about that be my guest, but I don't like taking part in the dumbing down of America. By the way, this goes much further than who the next president is. 





> Back on topic, I thought at first when I heard about Sarah Palin, I thought McCain was a big dummy. 
> 
> She has no experience at all. No business being a heartbeat away from being president yet, none. Horrible choice.
> 
> She has more experience than Obama. 
> 
> I guess her inexperience glares in the face of Obama, maybe McCain isn't a dummy.
> 
> I still don't really get it. I don't know why anybody would vote for McCain. I could if only I disliked Obama more. I will probably not waste any time with voting or making any more posts about politics. 
> ...


Agreed

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## Tock

> Saying things like "Barack knows what it's like to grow up in a country controlled by rich white people!!!" from his pulpit during a sermon.


Duh! 
Anyone who has grown up in the USA knows what it's like to grow up in a country that's controlled by rich white people. Rich white people constitute the majority of the office holders and policy makers here in the USA. Barrack's preacher is only stating the obvious . . .











> And what about his church giving a life achievment award to Louis Farrakan? A man who believes that white people where created by a nutty black scientist?


That's not any stranger than a man who beleives that the Earth is 6000 years old, that the first man had an intelligible conversation with a talking snake, and that the vast majority of humanity is destined to writhe in unspeakable torment for millions of billions of ages, all for the offense of harboring an honest doubt that the bible is 100% inerrant. 









> I really hate racists both white and black. It's people like that that keep all these issues in the limelight.


Look at the upside. At least you have an entire group of people that you are better than. 









> Oh, and what about Obama's Campaign office in Texas having a Cuban flag on the wall with the likeness of the communist mass murderer, Che Guevara, on it?


That was from Mark Cuban (the guy who owns the Dalllas Mavericks), and the likeness was of himself.










> His campaign denied suporting that or knowing about it but that CLEARLY shows you what kind of people support him.


Certainly they cannot be _Real Americans_ like yourself. 










> These same people are not what I call real Americans.


Of course not. 










> I'm sorry but I am an American and stand for the princicples this country what founded and built on.


Like slavery, no women voting, funding a state church with tax dollars, confiscating property owned by Native Americans (and then breaking treaties with them), throwing gay people in prison for having gay sex at home in private, confiscating the property of millions of asian-americans during WW2 and denying them their constitutional right of due process, etc etc etc?
Yep, America is better than a lot of other hell-holes on this planet, but it has lots of room for improvement. 













> I do not like fake people like Obama because he is a n empty suit and will only use the presidency to furhter his personal agendas.


Would you prefer a different candidate who would only use the presidency to further _your_ personal agendas?










> He is not living in the real world, most people aren't these days.


So true, so true . . .  :Icon Rolleyes: 








> Maybe I just have a more clar view of things because I wear boots and a gun to work.


That must be it.
Anyone who wears a gun to work (or, as you say, just "boots and a gun") certainly must have a unique view of things . . .

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## BUYLONGTERM

I have always been a die hard republican. After dealing with BUSH for the last 8 years and listening to Obama, I thought for thet first time in my life I would vote Democrat. But, after hearing McCain's speech last night, I am going vote for him. I look at it this way. He is NOT BUSH. He has MUCH more experience than OBAMA. I truly believe he cares about America. He is MUCH more of a leader than OBAMA. And I don't want to hear the crap about our economy right now. Who does everyone think runs congress?

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## Kingweb50

> Who does everyone think runs congress?



With as many liberals in both the house and senate right now even if McCain would veto a bill they have enough people to override it. Thats a scary situation.

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## BgMc31

> I have always been a die hard republican. After dealing with BUSH for the last 8 years and listening to Obama, I thought for thet first time in my life I would vote Democrat. But, after hearing McCain's speech last night, I am going vote for him. I look at it this way. He is NOT BUSH. He has MUCH more experience than OBAMA. I truly believe he cares about America. He is MUCH more of a leader than OBAMA. And I don't want to hear the crap about our economy right now. Who does everyone think runs congress?


1st let me preface this by saying I think Palin gave an excellent speech the other day. Even though I'm an Obama supporter I hae to give her credit. McCain, however, did a horrible job, IMO. He seemed lost and fustrated at times (some due to the protesters distractions). The crowd's perceived excitement seemed forced to me.

As far as congress is concerned, The Dems only have true control of the House. In the senate, its a one person advantage, not nearly enough to pass any legistation in their favor. And lastly, Bush vetoes every democratic proposal that crosses his desk and without the overwhelming majority to overcome that, congress' is spinning its wheels and nothing gets done. So yes look at the economy, McCain is Bush! I'm tired of hearing about him being a POW. That's all he talks about and basis his qualifactions soley based on that.

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## Kingweb50

Its easy to run as a liberal they say we will give you this we will give you that dont bother working for it even though it will cost more money then we could possibly have to spend. This is a dumb saying but didnt jesus say something like is it better for me to give you a fish or teach you how to fish.

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## 39+1

Dont confuse yourself or deny your feelings always vote for the best looking girl or man if you living the alternative lifestyle. Is that pkay with you carlos since you always make a fuss about how i champion the Non Homoerectus?

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## BgMc31

> Its easy to run as a liberal they say we will give you this we will give you that dont bother working for it even though it will cost more money then we could possibly have to spend. This is a dumb saying but didnt jesus say something like is it better for me to give you a fish or teach you how to fish.


That's a typical bullshit conservative argument! Making social services available is different from giving handouts and not expecting to people to work. Seems to me during the last Democratic administration this country had one of the lowest unemployment rates in history. If giving someone a handout is the same as giving people jobs then only a fool would be opposed to that.

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## FallenWyvern

> That's a typical bullshit conservative argument! Making social services available is different from giving handouts and not expecting to people to work. Seems to me during the last Democratic administration this country had one of the lowest unemployment rates in history. If giving someone a handout is the same as giving people jobs then only a fool would be opposed to that.



Politicians don't/can't help the economy. They can only get in the way.

I am not sure which is worse though, socialist handouts or a very expensive war. Pretty sure the war is.

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## xlxBigSexyxlx



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## Carlos_E

> Dont confuse yourself or deny your feelings always vote for the best looking girl or man if you living the alternative lifestyle. Is that pkay with you carlos since you always make a fuss about how i champion the Non Homoerectus?


Here I go again responding to an idiot. So you're insinuating that I vote based on looks?  :LOL:  Next time you try to make a point don't drop my name in it. I don't want my name associated with stupidity.

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## BITTAPART2

> I have always been a die hard republican. After dealing with BUSH for the last 8 years and listening to Obama, I thought for thet first time in my life I would vote Democrat.* But, after hearing McCain's speech last night,* I am going vote for him. I look at it this way. He is NOT BUSH. He has MUCH more experience than OBAMA. I truly believe he cares about America. He is MUCH more of a leader than OBAMA. And I don't want to hear the crap about our economy right now. Who does everyone think runs congress?


Oh I swore you were going to say you fell asleep.

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## BITTAPART2

BTW Palin isnt that hot, if you saw her out of the limelight she would just be some semi flabby, big skull havin mom with a bad accent. But its like when a teacher is Semi hot you automatically lend her the rights to hottness b/c shes a teacher and it helps you with your teacher fantasy.

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## eliteforce

I see this troll DeputyLoneWolf is back with his idiotic rant over and over again, i think last time i checked this forum a month ago i read the same thing he posts over and over again..

_"Obama-racist church, racist chrch, racist church, hes a racist a racist, racist "_
racism is policies, not a preacher that uses fiery politically incorrect rhetoric to complain about inequalities in american society.. In the 80s Obama and Wright worked on the issue of Aphartied South Africa-to put presure on that regime to end it's policies of discrimination, it's policies, not rhetoric..


The troopergate thing sounds pretty serious, the report comes out in early october..

IS there a california independence party, i think i love the idea of USA becoming a commonwealth, or more like the EU, with less central control.
''''
Republicans (Nazis): jihadists, wiretapping, terror, war, national id, torture

Democrats (Soviet Union): free healthcare, social security, war, welfare

Ron Paul (We The People): Uphold the constitution
''''
thats briliant :Bbbump:

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## Flagg

Man I just cant stand Sarah Palin the more and more I read about her..seriously, how can you credit this woman with intelligence when she denies ev0lution and believes the Earth is a few thousand years old? Her disregard for the environment and wildlife in general makes me sick.

Ive read quite a few newspapers here and listened to quite a few correspondants, and noone seems to like this woman much, especially women themselves! Sadly, that's the UK...

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## IronReload04

> John McCain has chosen Alaska Governor Sarah Palin (a 44 year-old female) as his running mate according to a senior campaign official. What are your thoughts on this?


"she fought corruption in alaska"

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## Voice of Reason



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## SMCengineer

> Politicians don't/can't help the economy. They can only get in the way.


Exactly. Boom and bust cycles (bubbles) are what effect the economy. During Clintons administration, he benefited from the technology bubble/boom not because he was a great president. That market collapsed as Bush was coming into office so the blame was never placed on Clinton.

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## j4ever41

> Exactly. Boom and bust cycles (bubbles) are what effect the economy. During Clintons administration, he benefited from the technology bubble/boom not because he was a great president. That market collapsed as Bush was coming into office so the blame was never placed on Clinton.



Thank you, im glad other people recognize this.But who is ever in the office at the time when good things happen they get credit and if bad things happen they get blame i guess its easier for people to think that way instead of actually putting thought into something.

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## Voice of Reason

http://www.ebaumsworld.com/video/watch/908790 :0hammer:  Youtube already yanked it hhmmm... 


dumb bitch???

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